You might Google this.
I read on it for hours
It's nice that I can run with normal traffic.
I do have a 700r4 in a street strip car-they can live on the street
But traction can hurt them. Heavy car and high rpm hurt them.
If you are building a cruiser they can do fine
If you intend to hit the go pedal it may not live forever
But all in all- for what I have in mine currently I do like it
An od trans is the only way to go for a true street car

 

I use the 700r4, I like it,fast out of the whole then shift quick lol . I have heard and read on them there not strong for a lot of torque. They both can b built up. Everyone has there preference .


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

 

First gear is nice!
3.06.
3-4 clutches, sun shell....
Mine is somewhat upgraded
I've been trying to find a new solution to the weak reverse input drum
The only thing I've read these days is to harden or cryogenically treat it and other internals

 

GM had the option of using either and chose to develop the 700 architecture. That's good enough for me.

 

info

http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=149034

 

200 4r

I have a 200 4r With all CK Performance parts. I built it my self and used his book. I like the gear ratios they are all most the same as a Muncie 4 speed. I did not have to change my exhaust pipes, all though i modified the cross member.
I have 255 60 15 and 4;10's with a mild 350 2400 stall converter. CK says i should be good up to 400 hp with the build that i did.:canada:
www.ckperformance.com

 

How difficult was the build and did you require a lot of specialty tools? I've been contemplating building one myself.

Great thread, I've also been trying to determine what transmission would be a good swap.

I have a 200 4r With all CK Performance parts. I built it my self and used his book. I like the gear ratios they are all most the same as a Muncie 4 speed. I did not have to change my exhaust pipes, all though i modified the cross member.
I have 255 60 15 and 4;10's with a mild 350 2400 stall converter. CK says i should be good up to 400 hp with the build that i did.:canada:
www.ckperformance.com

 

http://webrodder.com/article/700r4-vs-200r4-which-is-best

 

Here's Jake from Jakes Performance Transmissions reply to that "article":

There are a lot of misleading points made in that article.

Many of the parts represented in that article as being "weaker" in the 200-4R than the 700-R4 due to their size are simply incorrect.

200-4R front and rear planets are made using a steel carrier ( that appears somewhat cheaply made and weak looking), not cast iron like the 4L60 series units. I see broken 4l60 rear carriers fairly often. I've NEVER seen a broken 200-4R planetary. I've seen worn out ones in both units.

I've never seen the low roller clutch break in any 200-4R except ONE transbraked unit. I've seen them broken in 700s and 4L60E's.

The band isn't really an issue in either unit using aftermarket pieces.

The stock 200-4R input shaft is good for well over 500 HP. I've used it many times.
The stock 700-R4 and 4L60E one is NOT. They will break at less than 500 HP sometimes. They have 3 circuits feeding oil at the back, and although the shaft may be bigger around, it has a lot of material drilled out for the oil passages. It will snap off at one of the axial drilled passages.

The 200-4R forward drum is pretty much THE weak hard part. It's pretty safe to ~400 HP. It DOES NOT break at the weld. I've seen dozens of broken ones and they all break at the base of the splines.
That drum is friction welded from the OEM supplier.
I've seen welds break on aftermarket billet shafted drums that were defective, but not a stock one.

The OD sprag on a 200-4R doesn't fail.
It is the weak link to this day on a 4L60E. The aftermarket has made all kinds of improvements to this unit and there are some pretty neat parts out there now. However the forward sprag is the limiting factor. A forced 4-3 downshift at high rpm with power will kill it repeatedly.

The "one rear bushing" theory sounds good but holds no water in the real world. The 200-4R rear bushing holds up fine. The output shaft doesn't go through a case bushing but it is supported internally by the low support.

What they don't show is the really rigid internal center support in a 200-4R. They don't talk about powerflow, and other engineering aspects that give the 200-4R some clear advantages hydraulically and mechanically.

Bigger is better for some applications, but don't let a biased article be the basis for which OD to pick.

Both units have certain applications they work well in. One simple fact is most builders don't know how to make a 200-4R live, even though they may be good with other units. There are some simple tricks that make or break a 200-4R. Most aren't even secrets anymore.

200-4R cores and parts are becoming more scarce as well, so that influences some builders.

 

Bowtie Overdrives .com
Tons of information on both trans's there. The 200 has better gear ratios (the 1-2 drop on the 700 is horrible) and a better od ratio. Its also smaller, so your mods are less, and its lighter. The same size as a T350. Either can be built to handle substantial power. I have a CK custom billet 200R4 built by Chris at CK. The man knows his s**t when it comes to GM od transmissions. I had a 700R4 using internals suggested by, and supplied by Chris. Heavy car making 400hp, and it was flawless for the 10 years I owned the car. I HATED the 1-2 shift, but other than that, it was good. Both require a TV cable, and you will NEED to educate yourself about them. See the BTO side about that.

 

Bowtie Overdrives .com
Tons of information on both trans's there. The 200 has better gear ratios (the 1-2 drop on the 700 is horrible) and a better od ratio.

The one two shift is only a problem if you're either dragging the car or using the wrong rear gears. Porsche was one of the first to run a five speed and in their design you could only shift into first after a complete stop. Slowing to two miles an hour would only allow a pull away in second. This is not only how the 700 is designed but also how it should operate. When you choose to run really low gears like a 411 your first gear is so short as to be practically unusable and your top gear is hardly an overdrive. I run 3.08s and a 25.7" tire and it spins both of my 315s throughout first gear while still cruising below 2000

 

Similar to you I went from a T350 to the 700R4 . Very happy with the 700R4 because i drive the car on the freeway and am able to feel comfortable actually taking the car on longer runs without turning 3200 RPM for hours at a time on the freeway. I do not race my car so for me it was all about street ability. 373 gears with posi and putting out about 450 horsepower.

 

Its not a problem, its annoying. If your using it in a performance based application, it can knock the wind outa the motor and pull it right out of its power band. Why it was designed this way is simple. 85% of the vehicles its used in are big, heavy tanks, so they needed the gear to get them moving. From a performance stand point. There are better choices out there. Its all about your plans for the car.

 

There are better choices out there. Its all about your plans for the car.

I agree. one needs to know what his goals are.
I used the 700 for one car going mid 12's but am worried about it not lasting on a car that sees a lot of track time.

My trans guy is concerned about my 700 he built living behind 550-575hp and nitrous so he recommended we go 400 with GV OD.
If I went with 700 from anyone else Id probably go with Rossler.

the best choices for an auto for high hp at this time are arguably the 4L80e and 400 with gear vendors od. rossler is making a turbo glide.

from what I've been told is that some of the guys with the 4L80 and the 400 were taking off in 2nd gear so I had changed my mind to a shorty glide with a gear vendor OD but Ive just purchased a JW 400 case so this is the route Im going with a GV OD for my car making the most power.

 

In my opinion this is the way to go. Easy, good gear combo and much less hassle. Jack

http://cpttransmission.com/

 

Personally I'm going with the 200-4r because I like the gear spread better. From the research I have done suggests if you spec a cam with a wider LSA the spread of the 700r4 isn't as noticeable. If it were me I would spec the cam accordingly and if that was an option then I would go with the 200-4r.

 

I have been toying with the idea of swapping trans from th350 to the 200r4 i am running 3:08 rear gears with a 205/70/14 tire Overall Tire Diameter: 25.40 , just a cruiser no drag strip use would the 200r4 be a good pick with this gear and tire combo or would i have to swap gears??

 

Thanks guys for all the posts. Really leaning towards a 200r4 right now. Going to contact a few tranny shops tomorrow for some local opinions, and to see what kind of prices they have. Wish I could drive a car with a 700r4 just to see what I think of the 1st to 2nd gear ratios. I think I will go with the 200r4 if I can get it for not a lot more than the 700.
Will re-post on this thread when I get some local options.

 

dont do it. :no:
700r4

 

Yeah, I kinda do want to be talked into one. But you got me confused with a later poster. I currently have a 3.36 rear end, which I would probably change to a 3.73 if I get on OD transmission. Still like the 700 over the 200? I am just looking for real peoples opinion, cause whatever I get, I will be stuck with for a while if I don't like it. Right now, I really like my th350 in town, but drive too much on highways to really enjoy the high rpms. Just looking for my best choice for my needs. Thanks for all the advice.

 

I was thinking about a 6L80 for a project, but the 1st to 2nd drop there worries me too...4.02-2.36; the others are 1.53-1.15-.085-.065

Then there is the 8L90 with 4.56-2.97-2.08-1.69-1.27-1.00-.085-.065.

The Mopar Hellcats got a 4.70-3.13-2.10-1.67-1.29-1.00-.084-.067 with a 2.62 rear gear, and they claim low 11's in the 1/4, and 200+ top speed. Of course I haven't seen one yet that runs close to what they claim.

 

I run a 700r4 in my 55 truck with a built 327 small block with a 3:43 rear gear and I love it.
I go to shows 150 to 200 miles and it cruise great on the interstate.
The 63 vert I am currently building for my wife has a 700r4 as well.
I searched a lot locally and on line for a used 200 trans to have rebuilt and they are a lot harder to find. The local shop that rebuilds my transmissions really prefers the 700 a lot more and he does both.

The other recommendation is to ask around and find a good local builder. This way if you have issues you can take it to them to repair or adjust. Much easier than removing it shipping to someone across the country to find out it was a simple in car adjustment.

Bottom line its your car so do what you want! We all have opinions but your the guy that has to live with it.

 

Here was a good thread, closed now but the info is good. I went the 200 route and wouldn't do it any different if done again...

 

Here's the only other thing I'm going to ad. Both, WHEN BUILT PROPERLY, will cost the same, and do the job. I hated the 1-2 split in the 700. Its like a close ratio vs a wide ratio Muncie 4 speed. The close ratio Muncie is gear towards performance. I have run both transmissions, and I chose to go back to the 200 in my latest build for reasons I learned in running both. For you, its less work, and less associated fab cost's to go with the 200.

 

For those who like the (perceived) greater strength of the 700R4 over the 200-4R but don't like the big RPM drop from the 1-2 gear shift, check out this link and scroll down to 700R4 / 4L60E "Power Gear"

http://www.transmissioncenter.net/competition.htm

I have no experience with PATC, I just happened to find this a while back when I was looking for a new speedo gear.

I have a 700R-4 from Bowtie Overdrives. I'm very happy with the quality of the transmission and their customer service. I agree that a well built 200-4R (where ever you get it from) will be plenty durable in your car. And, with your 3.36:1 rear gears, you'll love which ever trans you choose.

 

I've ordered many parts from this company and very happy with the products they sell.

 

I've got a buddy that runs an Art Carr built 200-4r in a heavy 66 bel-air. Has a built 383 and sprays a 150 shot on it. He hasn't had any issues so far and it's been 3-4 years. My cousin had a pretty well built 406 in a 87 iroc with a built 700. It would burn the forward clutch's up in a year easily. And if the tv cable was out of adjustmant, it was done real fast.

 

Buy this book from Chris (CKPerformance). It will walk you through the process.

http://www.ckperformance.com/View/GM-2004R-TECHNICAL-MANUAL