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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #42
Before I forget, do you have the part number for the seat conversion brackets that you purchased? I'm in the middle of doing the same thing- bench to bucket seats, and I've heard wayward stories of the AMD pieces...
GroundUP IBX-X1 Seat Brackets
They are the type that has provisions for the center console, therefore go over the hump, But the also makes them "fall in place" AMD pieces and the GroundUp look very very similar. Im going to try and build my own adapters for my seats, so I wont be using OEM seat rails to line things up, but going to position them as close as I can.

Found this on here, best measurements I found so far.
 

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1973 Custom hatchback
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1,037 Posts
On my "later"list is bucket seats...….
awesome car BTW !
 

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GroundUP IBX-X1 Seat Brackets
They are the type that has provisions for the center console, therefore go over the hump, But the also makes them "fall in place" AMD pieces and the GroundUp look very very similar. Im going to try and build my own adapters for my seats, so I wont be using OEM seat rails to line things up, but going to position them as close as I can.

Found this on here, best measurements I found so far.
My dude. Thank you a bunch!
 

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70 Nova, 427, TKO600, Vintage Air, Terminator EFI
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GroundUP IBX-X1 Seat Brackets
They are the type that has provisions for the center console, therefore go over the hump, But the also makes them "fall in place" AMD pieces and the GroundUp look very very similar. Im going to try and build my own adapters for my seats, so I wont be using OEM seat rails to line things up, but going to position them as close as I can.

Found this on here, best measurements I found so far.
Hey Magnus if you're interested I have a set of adjustable seat brackets from, I think a 69 Camaro. I was collecting different items for my Nova when I was assembling it and I have some extra stuff left over. I'm just a few miles away from you. They are yours if you want them. Let me know.
 

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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #46
Hey Magnus if you're interested I have a set of adjustable seat brackets from, I think a 69 Camaro. I was collecting different items for my Nova when I was assembling it and I have some extra stuff left over. I'm just a few miles away from you. They are yours if you want them. Let me know.
Hi Ed and thanks for the offer, are they like these


I might take you up on that offer, but I have also already started working on some brackets, and idk when or how I would be able to swing by.
 

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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #47
Got some parts...

Centerforce throwout bearing


Summit Racing Clutch fork



And dialed in the new adjustable pivot ball (Yes, the calipers are zeroed on the thickness of the flatbar)
 

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#1 Clutch Geometry is not correct, causing out of adjustment for throwout bearing

I haven't been able to adjust the clutch linkage to get enough free pedal play, without having trouble in going from 1st to Reverse on my Tremec TKO 600, seems like a not so uncommon issue if you Google around. I adjusted it further and used a tiny camera to check for 1/8-1/4" of clearance between diaphragm spring and throw out bearing, but the noises got worse.

So I decided to got to the bottom of it, and do it right. I tore out the gearbox, clutch and flywheel and all the linkage. This is what I found.

Flywheel deck height = 0.970 (O.E height is supposed to be 0.960", and this was resurfaced when I put the Tremec in, so it has even more meat than stock, but that one checks out. Flywheel surfaces has some smaller imperfections, but I can still see the machine grooves from the cutter.

Diaphragm fingers on my RAM clutch has a little bit of wear, but seem fine. Clutch disc is missing some rubber around the anti chatter springs. Will see if I can replace them.

Throwout bearing shows wear from the diaphragm fingers, but not a whole lot, its not a self aligning one, but has a little bit of wiggle play. Height from finger to fingers is 0.6545"

Clutch Z bar is small block variant so, and the engine used to be on small block motor mounts but I corrected that, and from reading it seems like not just the length for the z bar is longer, but also the arms have different geometry. I will order the correct one, not sure how much this contributes for the overall geometry.

Bellhousing is a stock aluminum cast housing, that measures 4.7735" from engine flange to pivot ball, this should be 4.75" assuming stock flywheel (0.910-0.960" flywheel deck height), so that is off by 0.0235", not massive but something. I will either get a stock replacement pivot ball or an adjustable one to set it back to stock.

Clutch fork is stock GM and its showing some wear on the fingers where it manipulates the throw out bearing. Considering swapping it out, but it is also just a couple of thou off.

Questions for the audience:
  1. Do you think think the correct Z-bar is the biggest contributor to the out of whack geometry or is it something else? correct throwout bearing, probably?!
  2. Should I consider hydraulic setup, if I feel I can spend the money? Its a heavy clutch after all?
  3. I haven't seen any cracks in my bell housing, but what are the consideration for going to a steel scatter shield, now would be the time to sort that out, don't want to crawl around doing this in the future.
  4. While I have it all tore down, should I replace pilot bearing, its a cheap part, but it looks good to me, and input shaft on gearbox looks good.
  5. And to the final point, I have a tiny oil leak from my rear main seal, and yeah its not a whole lot, and it drips a bit, but less when driven frequently. It seems like the internet it split on this matter, on what to expect from big block and tiny oil leaks from rear main seal. Worth trying to do that now?
I will post some pics in the next post.
I had the same problem with my nova (383 SBC with 5sp tremic) I found the culpret to be the adjustable ball pivot. I was set to low. I raised it up to clutch specs ,tightened and lock tighted it & solved my problem. Redhot 69
 

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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #49
I had the same problem with my nova (383 SBC with 5sp tremic) I found the culpret to be the adjustable ball pivot. I was set to low. I raised it up to clutch specs ,tightened and lock tighted it & solved my problem. Redhot 69
Good to hear you sorted it out, and yeah I am hoping that getting new pivoball adjusted properly, new clutch fork and throwout bearing and z-bar will put me back in the right range, and the bearing retainer adapter should line things up tighter. Wish me luck!
 

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70 Nova, 427, TKO600, Vintage Air, Terminator EFI
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Hi Ed and thanks for the offer, are they like these


I might take you up on that offer, but I have also already started working on some brackets, and idk when or how I would be able to swing by.
Yes they look like what I have except mine don't include the chrome knob on the release lever. Mine has both release lever return springs and are for both front seats. I'm pretty sure mine are not original GM's as there are no markings.
As far as meeting, I did look at your photo list and it looks like you are a mechanic by trade so, if you are working Saturday I can run them up to you at the shop. Up to you. Any excuse I get to take mine for a ride is always a good excuse. If you're located in the South San Francisco area I'm in the south bay.
Also if you want, you can take a look at mine and see the issues I ran into being mine was also a bench and how I solved them just for some ideas.
 

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Hey Magnus . . . .

Would you Show u'r "Part Numbers" (your adjustable clutch ball , your new 'clutch - fork' part number,
ect) . . . . . which could help others out , down th' road . Match u'r B/H & clutch fork (fit's 10.5" - - 11" clutch , sbc / bbc . . . . ) .

Thanks for u'r pictures , too

jim
 
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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #52
Yes they look like what I have except mine don't include the chrome knob on the release lever. Mine has both release lever return springs and are for both front seats. I'm pretty sure mine are not original GM's as there are no markings.
As far as meeting, I did look at your photo list and it looks like you are a mechanic by trade so, if you are working Saturday I can run them up to you at the shop. Up to you. Any excuse I get to take mine for a ride is always a good excuse. If you're located in the South San Francisco area I'm in the south bay.
Also if you want, you can take a look at mine and see the issues I ran into being mine was also a bench and how I solved them just for some ideas.
I hear you on finding any excuse to go for a cruise! 👏 I will send you a private message.
 

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Discussion Starter #53
Twinshadows, good idea. Here are some links and part numbers for my setup.

Existing Setup:
Correction Parts:
 

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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #54
Got the BBC shifter linkage kit from AMD today and the Novak adapter ring. I went for the whole shifter kit, because it wasn't all that much more money as ordering just the pieces I needed, and I get all new hardware.

Here is what you get in the kit



I tried figuring out if there is any other difference between SBC/BBC Z bar except for the length, and the quick answer is no. same length from center of bar to holes on either arms, there is a bit more curve in the BBC clutch pedal arm. But, if you don't use the correct Z-bar you will not line up the clutch to fork arm correctly. (BBC to the left, SBC to the right)


Novak BR-4 Adapter fitted on the Tremec TKO600
 

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70 Nova, 427, TKO600, Vintage Air, Terminator EFI
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Got the BBC shifter linkage kit from AMD today and the Novak adapter ring. I went for the whole shifter kit, because it wasn't all that much more money as ordering just the pieces I needed, and I get all new hardware.

Here is what you get in the kit



I tried figuring out if there is any other difference between SBC/BBC Z bar except for the length, and the quick answer is no. same length from center of bar to holes on either arms, there is a bit more curve in the BBC clutch pedal arm. But, if you don't use the correct Z-bar you will not line up the clutch to fork arm correctly. (BBC to the left, SBC to the right)


Novak BR-4 Adapter fitted on the Tremec TKO600
What keeps that adapter in place?
 

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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #56
What keeps that adapter in place?
Press fit. Cleaned up the surfaces lightly and tapped it in place with a rubber mallet, it's not going anywhere. Idk how well they fit on older transmissions.
 

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Discussion Starter #57
Put together the clutch disc with new anti chatter springs. Getting ready to put it all back in the car, just need to find some time.



 

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69 Nova, 454 BBC, TKO
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Discussion Starter #58 (Edited)
Tonight I got the clutch & bell housing installed, and I am working on the new clutch linkage. On thing I noticed was that the location of my return spring isn't optimal, it was pulling at an odd angle(angling the cluch fork) and its also not strong enough to really release that throwout bearing and pulling back the pedal all the way up.

I've hear of people using hose clamps on their header pipes to attach the spring to, I would love to hear or see pictures of how some of you have done it.

Down below you can see one spring attached to the frame (thats how it was before) and then I was just mocking up a second spring with a hose clamp to the header. I might need to get different spring to get more pull, to make sure the throw out bearing releases fully and that the clutch fork is pulled straight by the springs.

Any tips welcome.

Originally it was attached to the exhaust manifold.

 

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Discussion Starter #59 (Edited)
Some quick googling shows some different methods, either the frame diagonally like I have it, or hose clamp on header, or by making a bracket and attaching to on the the oil pan bolts.

But what I realized from the knowledgeable Big Dave in this Nova.net post was that I am probably missing some under dash return spring for the pedal. Anyone know which one that is or how it attaches? Or if it's even a thing for 3rd gens. I can't find any info.
 

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Some quick googling shows some different methods, either the frame diagonally like I have it, or hose clamp on header, or by making a bracket and attaching to on the the oil pan bolts.

But what I realized from the knowledgeable Big Dave in this Nova.net post was that I am probably missing some under dash return spring for the pedal. Anyone know which one that is or how it attaches? Or if it's even a thing for 3rd gens. I can't find any info.
My uncle has a '72 SS with a factory 4-speed. I'll be seeing him in the near future, and can take a peek under the dash for a photograph.
 
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