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Ok, you read alot about solid roller cams not liking to idle much, and that the lack of oiling from constant low rpm can cause lifter failure(along with high spring rates and lifter skidding). Plus reduced spring life from the agressive lobes and high lifts. But what about constant higher rpm use? How do they like or dislike highway driving, say at around 3000-3500rpm constant? You never hear about that end of the question.Thanks.
 

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i do believe comp cams makes a solid roller with a small groove in it for this same reason you ask dont hold me to it though i believe its in there line of street solid rollers usually at 3000 or so rpms you are already in the cam until it stops making power say somewhere in the 7500 range who knows i dont think you will have an issue with that. look at all them nascar cup motors they spend there life even higher than freeway speeds :yes: or all them dirt track guys running up in the 7000 to 7500 range for 200 laps or so they come down on rpm in the turns then back up to 7500 rpms and there motors stay together just fine :yes: ................................. sometimes :D
 

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solid roller lifters just don't get enough oil spash, even at 3,000RPM ( I know hard to believe it) thats why Comp has the oil groove in it. Like hydraulic flat tappets prolonged idling is no good. Some rollers last longer than others. There is no set life expectancy with them. I guess the smoother and lighter you can make the overall valvetrain be the better.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
i do believe comp cams makes a solid roller with a small groove in it for this same reason you ask dont hold me to it though i believe its in there line of street solid rollers usually at 3000 or so rpms you are already in the cam until it stops making power say somewhere in the 7500 range who knows i dont think you will have an issue with that. look at all them nascar cup motors they spend there life even higher than freeway speeds :yes: or all them dirt track guys running up in the 7000 to 7500 range for 200 laps or so they come down on rpm in the turns then back up to 7500 rpms and there motors stay together just fine :yes: ................................. sometimes :D
Nascar Cup engines don't use roller cams. They use solid flat tappet cams.
 

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i do believe comp cams makes a solid roller with a small groove in it for this same reason you ask dont hold me to it though i believe its in there line of street solid rollers usually at 3000 or so rpms you are already in the cam until it stops making power say somewhere in the 7500 range who knows i dont think you will have an issue with that. look at all them nascar cup motors they spend there life even higher than freeway speeds :yes: or all them dirt track guys running up in the 7000 to 7500 range for 200 laps or so they come down on rpm in the turns then back up to 7500 rpms and there motors stay together just fine :yes: ................................. sometimes :D
If it's a roller I know they make lifters for solid roller street applications that have an additional oil ring. I bought them for my motor. Just look up lifters on Summit and search a bit in the descriptions.
 

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I have been running solid roller lifters for years.

Street and strip!

I have never had a issue with a roller lifter.
I had a issue with a cam, but the lifter was perfect.

I do run a rev kit to prevent skidding.

I also run a quality valve spring. (I have a connection)

The push-rods and rockers must be a good quality to stand the extra pressure.

I do run a HV High pressure pump.!!!!!!:eek:

AL
 

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Same here Al.;)

I never had any problems on the street with a solid roller lifter or cam either.

Of course none of the cars were "daily drivers" and I never put more than 25,000 miles on a set of lifters. I put more than that on a mechanical roller cam though.

How could you have a problem with the cam and not the lifter?
 

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Same here Al.;)



How could you have a problem with the cam and not the lifter?
Cam was soft, not heat treated correctly. Lifter was perfect! I could not believe it myself.

Al
 

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Al,

The rev kit also cuts down on the lash take-up that "Hammers" the bottom roller bearing and axle.

Just think about how small the little needle bearings are around the axle. Now think about the spring load the axle and bearings see. It's a little math but you can figure YOUR actual open pressure then multiply it by your rocker ratio. So 600#'s (fairly wimpy roller spring) would be 900#'s at the lifter.:eek: There's not that much surface area on the one or two needle bearings that just happen to be at the bottom area of the axle to spread that load out over.:no: So either the bearings themselves give way and crumble or the axles wear (which is the most common) to the point of failure. HEAT is the biggest killer there. Whether it's from the lack of lube, oil temps too high, wrong oil to offer adequate protection, or just plain metal fatigue.... Hippo (high pressure oiling to the lifter bearings) does help significantly. The slots in the lower lifters doesn't do much of anything.:no: It would actually do better if you grooved the lifter bore :yes: but then going back to a flat tappet lifter would probably require bushing the bores.:rolleyes:

In any event, to run them on the street is a crap shoot. If you're a gambler.....go for it. Some people have all the luck! There's plenty people who run them and never have a problem. Then there's substantially more that are rebuilding their engines because of the trash that went through them after a lifter failed.

For me, on the street, I can get pretty aggressive with a solid flat tappet. More-so than what a LOT of the common "Street rollers" are and will last indefinitely as long as the proper oil is used.:yes:
 

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I put about 30,000 miles on a Comp solid street roller before axle failure took out a few lobes--then I read Comp says to check the lifters every 3000 miles!
I lost a couple lifters on the Power Tour after 1000 miles, but these were very old Isky tall body lifters that weren't drilled for oiling the axles--after drilling they have been trouble-free. I think a lack of valve spring pressure can be just as hard on the lifters due to lack of control--this set-up ran a rev kit; I talked to some cam engineers about rev kits, and they seem to think the only place you need them today is boats and off-road where the rpm can see sudden spikes from getting loose.
I do a lot of idling and driving in traffic, and even with restrictors and a standard volume/standard pressure pump, I haven't seen any problems with my current Lunati lifters. 600+psi springs too.
 

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Al,

The rev kit also cuts down on the lash take-up that "Hammers" the bottom roller bearing and axle.
That is what is know as SKIDDING OR SKATING Same thing.

Al
 

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I never experienced a roller failure. Several setups in the last 36 years. I do wonder about spring life when our engines go through the shutting down and cooling heat cycles.
At any given time there ars some springs completely compressed for weeks at a time. What happens to a hot spring compressed and cooled many times over? That's what I wonder....

Don
 

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That is what is know as SKIDDING OR SKATING Same thing.

Al
"SKIDDING OR SKATING" was explained to me as moments in time where the lifter's roller bearing in contact with the cam didn't turn. Typically during moments in time when the valvetrain becomes harmonic or for whatever reason "Lofts" the lifter off the lobe of the cam like the "Launcher" style profiles. Not when the lash is "Taken-up". Which is also why a lot of people are running as little lash as possible.

I may be wrong, but it doesn't happen very often. :no::devil: I try not to make it a habit.:D

Maybe if I get time I'll give Harold or Harvey a call later.:yes:
 

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I used to run nothing but solid flat-tappets during the 70s and 80s and then finally started using a mechanical roller in the late 80s early 90s. Night and day difference in performance.

For my more moderate performance engines I now only use hydraulic flat-tappets. I'll never buy another flat-tappet solid cam unless I'm restoring a vintage car that came with one from the factory. Once you go roller, you'll never want to go back to a solid flat-tappet. Night and day improvement in performance with the ability to run a lot more radical profiles.

To switch from a solid flat-tappet to a mechanical roller you're looking at about $1,000 or more depending on how radical you are going. Sounds like a lot (which is why it took so long for me to make the switch) but the cost is well-worth it.;)
 

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I may be wrong, but it doesn't happen very often. :no::devil: I try not to make it a habit.:D

Maybe if I get time I'll give Harold or Harvey a call later.:yes:

HAHA!

Your not wrong, just multiple words for same condition.

The two conditions in simple terms.

Hammering,-- Lifter is bouncing on cam

Skidding-- The roller is not rolling, following the cam.

IMO! A rev kit solves these problems.
Or a hydraulic roller!

UNLESS YOUR USING SOME CHEEP KNOCK OFF PARTS!!

Al
 

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I used to run nothing but solid flat-tappets during the 70s and 80s and then finally started using a mechanical roller in the late 80s early 90s. Night and day difference in performance.

For my more moderate performance engines I now only use hydraulic flat-tappets. I'll never buy another flat-tappet solid cam unless I'm restoring a vintage car that came with one from the factory. Once you go roller, you'll never want to go back to a solid flat-tappet. Night and day improvement in performance with the ability to run a lot more radical profiles.

To switch from a solid flat-tappet to a mechanical roller you're looking at about $1,000 or more depending on how radical you are going. Sounds like a lot (which is why it took so long for me to make the switch) but the cost is well-worth it.;)
The ability to get a higher lift with a short duration makes a street engine go ZOOM!!!!!!! IMO!

it is amazling differant!

And the next one you do, do a 4/7 timing swap!
Makes for a smooth engine!
And everyone likes the sound! (I DO)

Al
 

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And the next one you do, do a 4/7 timing swap!
Makes for a smooth engine!
And everyone likes the sound!
I did the 4/7 swap on my 414"--didn't hear any difference, might have been a hair smoother, but was off 10 h.p. over same cam with conventional firing order. Different dyno days could account for the difference, but W.J. says it won't show anything on the dyno, but the car might go faster.
 

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HAHA!

Your not wrong, just multiple words for same condition.

The two conditions in simple terms.

Hammering,-- Lifter is bouncing on cam

Skidding-- The roller is not rolling, following the cam.

IMO! A rev kit solves these problems.
Or a hydraulic roller!

UNLESS YOUR USING SOME CHEEP KNOCK OFF PARTS!!

Al

Absolutely agreed!!:D Cheap knock-off Chinese roller lifters will do nothing but cause a BAD DAY!!!

The ability to get a higher lift with a short duration makes a street engine go ZOOM!!!!!!! IMO!

it is amazling differant!

And the next one you do, do a 4/7 timing swap!
Makes for a smooth engine!
And everyone likes the sound! (I DO)

Al
I did the 4/7 swap on my 414"--didn't hear any difference, might have been a hair smoother, but was off 10 h.p. over same cam with conventional firing order. Different dyno days could account for the difference, but W.J. says it won't show anything on the dyno, but the car might go faster.
Everyone talks about the 4/7 swap.....why not try the LSx firing order..:devil:
 

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Absolutely agreed!!:D Cheap knock-off Chinese roller lifters will do nothing but cause a BAD DAY!!!





Everyone talks about the 4/7 swap.....why not try the LSx firing order..:devil:
you,.... you,..... you,....... mean a ford firing order? OMG...:devil:
 
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