Chevy Nova Forum banner

1 - 20 of 116 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I did a search through the site to see if this subject had been touched upon but didn't find anything. You can go to all kinds of sites for this but I trust the people here for info. I have thought for the longest time about switching from regular oil to synthetic but always figure...naaaa... and buy my same old Quaker state. What are some of your thoughts on this, can I just drain the pan and swith over to synthetic? Does it make a world of difference?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,478 Posts
Engine wear is supposed to be greatly reduced with a good synthetic oil. Amsoil has had independent testing done on their oil, and they claim to be the best. They have a challenge out to other synthetic oil makers that if their oil proves to be better, Amsoil will pay for the research. One test that they did is to run a big rig filled with synthetic for 400K miles without an oil change. At the end of the 400K miles, the engine was torn down, and the wear measured. The wear was equivilent to an engine running regular oil with regular oil changes. According to the testing done by Amsoil, Mobil1 is the closest in wear protection to Amsoil. It is much more readily available, and it is less expensive. That is what I am running in my pickup. My engine is fairly new, it has about 20K miles on it. Years and miles will tell the story of how good it really is. Until then I rely on the test results I can find that say synthetic is well worthe the extra money. The fact that you can go extended miles with synthetic oil makes it worth it. With regular oil I changed it every 3K miles. With the synthetic I change it every 12K miles, with a filter changes and top-off during that time. The Dodge Viper comes from the factory filled with synthetic oil, as does Polaris ATV's. I believe you will start seeing more and more manufacturers following suit.

Randy (yes, I believe in synthetic oil!) ;)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,405 Posts
We've have discussed the subject before but the posts must have been deleted in the last pruning.

I've used synthetic since Mobil 1 first came out. I've also tested oils on the dyno and I'm convinced there is a difference.

However
  • Synthetic is expensive.
  • Fuel economy benefits won't offset the cost.
  • I don't agree with claims of extended oil change intervals. Oil doesn't wear out, it gets dirty with contamination. Solubles are solubles.
  • Power gains are there but they are very small about 1% or less
  • Loose, worn and leaky engines will pass more synthetic oil. Don't waste your money if your engine is on it's last legs.
  • Some engines are actually designed to run synthetic and have tighter clearances. It's counter productive to use dinosaur oil in these engines.
I've found on my SBC engined cars that using full synthetic only in the winter months is the most cost effective method. Synthetics have a wide tmeperature capabilties. Synthetic's excels in it's cold performance. Engine wear is the greatest on cold startup. In sub zero weather regular oil flows like molasses.

Synthetics are resistant to high temperature breakdown but if you engine oil is getting that hot you have a serious cooling problem.
It doesn't get real hot in Michigan and my engine oil stays around 220 so I switch to cheaper oil the rest of the year and keep to 3,000 mile oil and filter changes.

Regular oil changes extend the life of your engine but won't prevent rebuilds.
Gaskets get old and seals get hard. Valve guides will wear out eventually and even sooner if you have really good seals (they need some oil to stay lubricated)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
758 Posts
Synthetics will do a great job of cleaning the inside of your engine. This can be good and bad.

The down side is if you have been running dino oil for many miles, eventhought the engine may still be tight as a drum, there could be areas where gaskets/seals have developed a bit of a buildup and actually kept the gasket from leaking.

By putting synthetic in it will dissolve the bit of build up and leaks may develope. New type gaskets, like the 1 piece oil pan gaskets/ printo seal intake gaskets are a great thing to use because they seal better and are less likley to leak with synthetic.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,478 Posts
Toms73NovaSS said:
Synthetics will do a great job of cleaning the inside of your engine.
Hmmm, I guess that explains why my neighbors Ford F350 diesel pickup that he uses to pull his backhoe tractor to jobsites still had amber colored oil after 6000 miles on an oil change, and 200K total miles on the truck. He has run synthetic in it since break-in. How often do you see amber colored oil in a diesel engine??

Randy (very rarely)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,710 Posts
i totally believe in synthetics. ive run synth in the motor ,tranny and rear.
on our work trucks we have the allison transmission, they will warrenty the tranny for a lifetime if you switch it over to sythetic within the first 500 miles.
so it says something.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,405 Posts
I found this old post in my files:

I've been involved with and have tested synthetics since Mobil One first came out. I even still have an original metal can of Mobil One.

Anyway,
Synthetics are often misunderstood when compared to dinosaur oil.

First ones were tested by the same viscosity standards as conventional oils. Viscosity used to be tested by pouring a set quantity through a fixed orifice (Brix cup) and timing how long it takes to go through. Sort of like sand through an hourglass. Because the molecules flow easily, the time to pass through was less and they got a lower viscosity rating.
Old timers who thought heavier is better, decided the lower viscosity was a bad thing and shunned the expensive and runny Mobil One.

Mobil had to add thickeners to get the public to accept it.

Things have changed since then. Nowadays, you can get 0-20w oil and some manufacturers use it as an OEM spec.

Synthetics aren't new (Nazi's worked on synthetic fuel and oil technology during WWII), but it's taken a while for the general public to fully accept them.

Tips:
1. Choose a fully synthetic oil. I'm currently testing Pennzoil synthetic with Penzane. It's a substance developed for NASA for cold/hot extremes of space. Initial results look good.

2. Put aside pre-conceived notions of viscosity = protection. Heavy weight oil takes more power to pump. In sub-zero temps you can easily spin a bearing in it's bore with 50w.

3. Choose pump spring and clearances appropriately. Tighter clearances preferrable. Loose clearances need thicker oil to slow down internal bleeding.

4. Change oil/filter at same interval. Cost is higher for synthetics so don't bother using with a leaker or oil burner.

5. Synthetics are no contest winner in sub zero climates. 90% of engine wear is on cold start-up.
Leave a qt of regular oil outside (winter) or in the freezer over night and try to pour out. Now think about the pump trying to move that taffy to the bearings.

---Paul W.
Comments:
1. The best products are often more expensive BUT being most expensive does not guarantee it's the best product.

2. All major oil companies make synthetic oil. Look for "100% synthetic" on the label. A blended oil is cheaper and maybe a good way to try them out. If your engine doesn't like it then no point in going to full synth.

3. NO oil will fix a worn engine. If your engine is worn you probably should stick to cheaper conventional oil.

4. Synthetics are soluble in and compatible with conventional oil. You can use synthetics only in the winter and conventional in the summer if you want.

5. Synthetics can tolerate higher temperatures without coking. Excellent in turbocharged applications that have a pressure fed oil line to the turbo. Summertime ambient temperatures of 100+ degrees are still colder then engine coolant temperatures. If your oil temperatures are exceeding 240-250 degrees, then an oil cooler is a good idea.

6. I design my engines to work with synthetics. I select clearances, pressure spring, and oil pump to maximize benefit.

7. Even with all that the gains will be small. I've seen maybe up to a 6 hp gain on a 600 hp race engine, but realistically the street gains should be measured in Watts. Benefits include lower oil temps from reduced friction, easier cranking when cold, higher manifold vacuum, slightly better fuel economy (.5 to .7 mpg) and improved torque.

8. It's not nitrous. Don't expect a miracle.

9. Try the Pennzoil 10w-30 100% synthetic with "Pennzane". Subjectivly it seems better to me so far than the Valvoline or Mobil One. I could be just imagining the better driveability so I'd like second opinion.

---Paul W.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
311 Posts
I have no advice or anything on this subject, it sounds like these are questions regarding street vehicles. All I ask is if you are drag racing your car please don't run synthetic, it doesn't clean up well off of the track surface at all if you blow up. We had 2-3 races cancelled completely after synthetic oil spills that they were un able to clean up.
 

·
Registered
1974 chevy. Ova
Joined
·
1,179 Posts
Mobil 1 leaks & all oil related questions

the motor is together, i get my steering box on tomorrow, and then i can start putting the engine/tranny back in the car. and now for a few final questions:

what weight oil should be used for break-in?
what weight oil is best for those crucial first miles?
what weight oil should i use for racing?

this may seem like a dumb question, but is there anything special about these race oils, like the castrol high rpm synthetic stuff or the valvoline race oil? are there any special steps for switching from regular to synthetic oil?

amos
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,924 Posts
I'd use a decent quality regualr 10-30 weight oil for break-in. For regular street and race use I run Mobil 1 synthetic. The LT1 guys swear by it. GM supplied it in the LT1 and LT4 Vettes. IMO, this stuff works. I'd say it can be worth 1-3 hundredths in the quarter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
140 Posts
i personaly run kendall gt1 for all of it in 20w 50 seems to work just fine and is much cheaper than the synthetic stuff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,400 Posts
oiling

IMO, i would use the cheapest oil for break-in (CHEVRON 10-30). i wouldnt use synthetic right away, i would put a good amount of miles on the motor before i use synthetic, i dont think synthetic or anything thick will allow for proper break-in. but after that, MOBIL 1 is good, and KENDALL. just my 2 cents.

JOHN

hey SUPERNOVA, do u have any oil pressure problems after 4kRPM, my motor after 4k drops 40psi, and @ 3k its @ 65psi. i started an oiling problem thread, check it out. i askin u this cause we almost have the same motor setup. are u running oil restrictors?????
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
140 Posts
nope no oiling problems its stays right at 50 after warm and yes i have oil restrictors on it, also took the bypass spring out of the oilfilter adapter and put a plug in it.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,519 Posts
Mobil 1 leaks & all oil related questions

I just read this article on Royal Purples web site. It's some mods they made to a 383 crate engine. Here is a direct quote:

We were so close to 500 lb-ft that we decided to pull out the magic wand: synthetic oil. It's generally worth a few power numbers, so we drained the 10W30 dinosaur sauce and poured in Royal Purple's 5W30 street oil (lighter-weight racing oil is also available). It took three dyno pulls for the synthetic to do its thing, then it made the repeatable power we wanted: 502.9 lb-ft and 463 hp. As an average from 2,500 to 5,800 rpm, the Royal Purple bought us 7 hp and 10 lb-ft. Combined with the extra engine protection and heat resistance, this is a no-brainer.

Of course Royal Purple wouldn't use that article if it didn't make them look favorable. But my question is, do you gain this HP/TQ at the expense of lubrication properties or any other drawbacks? Anyone have any experience with it? At $4.99 it's expensive, but not really out of reach.

Any thoughts?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
417 Posts
Horsepower tv tested a late model camaro with stock fluid and then with royal purple oil, at fluid, diff fluid, and cooling additive and gained 10 hp at the rear wheels. I will try it for the cost difference for sure.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Hey 72 I haven't used the Royal purple brand but switched to Mobil 1 synthetic around 5 years ago.I use it it every thing I own right down to my lawn mowers.Never had an engine failure yet and plan to continue to use it!Not really sure if it helps but a lot of new things come with it from the factory.My Polaris 4 wheeler uses 0-40.IMO its a good thing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
232 Posts
Don't know if it was Royal Purple or Luck but I am still running the same exact rotating assembly all summer, in July I sheared a converter bolt an it hit the oil filter with a 1/8 in hole on a 10.2 130mph pass, drove all the way to the pit area before losing oil pressure completly, in August I was spraying er hard an broke the 2nd main web from the cam to the outer main bolts on both sides, the piece of block came out with a tap from a hammer. Same crank, rods, n pistons are still in a Dart block, bearings were like new but replaced anyways when we put everything in the lil M block. Just ran mid 9'[email protected] a week ago with it, prolly luck huh.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
857 Posts
I run synthetic (mobile 1) in everything and have no problems at all,So i would'nt say you sacrifice anything at all.I noticed a reduction in temperature in my 406 engine.That is proof enough for me!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,648 Posts
Mobil 1 leaks & all oil related questions

I installed a new Felpro one piece oil pan gasket on a 327 as per instructions and suddenly I have leaks in the front and rear main seal after using Mobil 1. Took it down,cleaned everything up,used RTV sealer in the 4 corners,let it dry overnight and put the oil back in it. Leaks again. Drained it again,I was told synthetics are known to do this. Now I'm using 10/40 Valvoline oil.....no leaks,perfectly dry..what is the problem? Am I doing something wrong?
 
1 - 20 of 116 Posts
Top