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Just a thought on this important topic. Since Mobil 1 SAE 15W-50 oil is recommended by the manufacturer even though the zinc content is about the same as other oils,; maybe the fact that it is high viscosity and synthetic which both factors contribute to less friction and wear. The zinc content is important, but so are other factors. There is a price to pay for having stiff vave springs and aggressive cam profiles and expecting long life on the street.
 

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Just a thought on this important topic. Since Mobil 1 SAE 15W-50 oil is recommended by the manufacturer even though the zinc content is about the same as other oils,; maybe the fact that it is high viscosity and synthetic which both factors contribute to less friction and wear. The zinc content is important, but so are other factors. There is a price to pay for having stiff vave springs and aggressive cam profiles and expecting long life on the street.
After reading this, I did some more information searching and found the Mobil One fact sheet, https://www.mobil.com/lubricants/-/...hash=E24FB7F9AD42AD6E84FF14F20C94A7396657AC09 .I read thru that, and decided that I'm switching to Mobil One 15w50 .
 

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Hi fellow Nova nuts...... There has been some discussions for the last 6 or 7 months, maybe longer about which oils contain enough ZDDP for flat tappet cams.

Repinter just quoted me on my conversation with Valvoline... and has doubt, I too have doubt... so I am in search of definitive information on oils that will suit the needs of the flat tappet cam masses....

I have done some searching for the last month or so and have seen various opinions/posts on other fourms but never definitive answers as to which oils are safe for flat tappet cams. I have looked at product data sheets.. some times they read like stereo instructions.... not very help full....

There are very expensive oils out there that claim to have over 1800 PPM of ZDDP. like Champion, Joe Gibbs, and one other that escapes me now. but I wonder about the oil as suited for street use as they all say RACE ONLY.

My own mission has now become to find these oils that are safe to use in High lift, high spring rate cams of flat tappet design for street use.

So far I have identified 4 possible oil manufactures,,,, I will contact them further and ask to speak to a authoritative person for definitive info regarding flat tappet cams and the levels of ZDDP.... so that I may inform my fellow brethren in flat camdom hood if their product is safe to use.

what i would really like to find is am old API rating of S/E or S/G

It looks like one synthetic and 3 conventional oils may meet the needs of our engines....

I have been getting a good bit of education on oil additives and their use and safe levels for protection of flat cams.

I will post up as info becomes available.....
I BELIEVE that the heavy duty (diesel) oils like 15w40 are high ZZDP. Thats what I've been using for decades without issues. Read the label to be sure, it's just habit for me at this point.
 

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Just came across this post and felt this old thread is relevant for using diesel oils in a gasoline motor. Check it out if you're interested. It has some good arguments both ways but the consensus is to stray from diesel oils in a gasoline engine due to the higher engine operating temps needed for the ZDDP to activate in the diesel oils, where the oils designed for gasoline contain the ZDDP which is formulated to activate at a lower engine operating temp. Just a thought. Good thread to read anyway from a reputable site and source for all things lube! :) Enjoy :geek:(y)

 

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Hi fellow Nova nuts...... There has been some discussions for the last 6 or 7 months, maybe longer about which oils contain enough ZDDP for flat tappet cams.

Repinter just quoted me on my conversation with Valvoline... and has doubt, I too have doubt... so I am in search of definitive information on oils that will suit the needs of the flat tappet cam masses....

I have done some searching for the last month or so and have seen various opinions/posts on other fourms but never definitive answers as to which oils are safe for flat tappet cams. I have looked at product data sheets.. some times they read like stereo instructions.... not very help full....

There are very expensive oils out there that claim to have over 1800 PPM of ZDDP. like Champion, Joe Gibbs, and one other that escapes me now. but I wonder about the oil as suited for street use as they all say RACE ONLY.

My own mission has now become to find these oils that are safe to use in High lift, high spring rate cams of flat tappet design for street use.

So far I have identified 4 possible oil manufactures,,,, I will contact them further and ask to speak to a authoritative person for definitive info regarding flat tappet cams and the levels of ZDDP.... so that I may inform my fellow brethren in flat camdom hood if their product is safe to use.

what i would really like to find is am old API rating of S/E or S/G

It looks like one synthetic and 3 conventional oils may meet the needs of our engines....

I have been getting a good bit of education on oil additives and their use and safe levels for protection of flat cams.

I will post up as info becomes available.....


Thanks, great info.

After I built my flat tappt hydrulic lifter engine I made sure to do it correctly. Assembly lube on all parts and a full 20 minutes at 2000rpm.

Simpmple simon.

People want to skip steps these days. Dont do that.

My engine is basicaly un-breakable at this point.

After break in with the shell (diesil) oil I ran one more cycle of 500 miles then changed the oil to Penn Oil.

1962 Nova Jrouche .
 

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Right! A pain..

1977 is when I started taking IC engines apart, and putting them back together.

You should be able to do that. JR

Engines are pretty basic and all very similar..

I have built big fat four cylenders that are over 5000lbs..

And I have built a 14,000rpm four cylender. That lives at 14k all day. JR
 

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I installed a choppy flat tappet cam a few months ago and broke it in twice by running at 2000-2500 for 15 minutes each time. I use a quarter bottle of Lucas additive and standard (cheap) 10w-30 conventional oil. The key is to use top quality moly cam grease, not break in lube, and vary the RPM so that the cam work hardens properly

I've done several engines like this and only wiped a lobe when I got water in the engine doing extreme 4x4 stuff. They don't like water lol.

I did my first oil change last weekend and all is good so far. I only recently started using additive in my engines. Any brand should be OK. Here's a pic of the oil at the end of the drain.... good luck!


Tire Land vehicle Wheel Car Vehicle
 

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Just got a call from a buddy . He called GM tech and asked them what kind of oil to use in his flat tappet crate engine. They returned his call by saying GM does NOT recommend adding zinc to the oil. Just a good synthetic 10-30 oil. After all this time and talk about zinc additive and you hear this right from GM. Comments???????
 

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Comments???????
Lots and lots!!! So how do they address warranty work on new crate motors when the cams flat out a lobe or five? "Sorry, Sir/Ma'am, you used synthetic oil for break-in? That voids the warranty".... I can hear it now. WTF?!? So how do we know who to trust? Trust the cam.... Trust the cam! I find it difficult to believe someone would even say this in confidence or tongue-in-cheek at/from GM... That's just crazy talk! IS he talking following complete break-in cycle? or for break-in too?!?
 

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as I understand some of this, just pouring a bottle of additive in with fresh oil does not provide the same protection as oils designed with formulas that have products within them - yes, you need to do research for quality oils, which are not cheap, that provide protection. the current oil formulations, and requirements of modern engines have quite obviously changed. the GM guys answer likely depended on how much he was told about the motor in question - likely not thinking beyond needs of new motors
 

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I don't think the additives are necessary as long as the cam was broken properly. However, because all the talk about Zinc and Phosphorus, I added a quarter bottle of Lucas the last cam job I did. Adding the whole bottle seems like a bad idea but that's just my opinion on it - I don't have any scientific reason, it just seems right. See my post above for the break in procedure.
 

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I understand the necessity of using a non-detergent break-in oil specifically for break-in like Brad Penn or Driven (and others) but even after break-in, I am hearing more and more stories even from respected builders who are saying at least for the first 5K miles, it's important to have the proper zinc in the oils and use a non-detergent oil until the heat cycles and the facing of all wear-points are hardened as they 're coming out of ductility from the work they're doing. I see no purpose to run an additive for the entire life of the engine unless there is some specific reason due to a certain internal part needing the additives. Good, quality oils are imperative to the longevity of our engines and spending $10k or more on a street engine for a daily needs to be justified by taking proper care of it and making it last well over 100k miles and still holding its own. Much anecdotal commentary about additives and what they do/don'd do but... experience and seeing flat lobes on a motor well past break-in without any issues in the oil leaves me wondering if we shouldn't extend the additive for a bit more until everything is proven to about 5k miles... more or less. That's my mindset. Looking at bearing shells and lifter faces as well as piston skirts and rocker /valve tips and stems shows the evidence I need to continue my use of additives for a while past break-in.
 
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