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Discussion Starter #1
I've finally got the interior the way I want it. All the mechanical changes and problems are done, so now comes the paint.
I've got some sanding to do and then I'm applying a 2k urethane hb primer surfacer.
Following up with a sealer, then Egyptian gold metallic for the primary color with a jet black stripes down the sides meeting on the roof.
My profile picture is me old car which was crashed. Plan is to resurrect her.
Wish me luck. I'm goin' in.
 

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In for pics.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I have two questions for any painters:
I'm painting my car in two colors -
base is going to be Egyptian gold metallic
Stripes are going to be jet black

Can I use the same primer sealer under both?

Should I paint the base color first or the stripes?
 

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Do u have a better picture of the stripes your trying to put on the car? I think I have an idea of your stripe scheme, but I just wanted to make sure before I answer your questions. The avatar picture is to small to make it out completely.
 

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Same sealer, do the whole car at once. base both colors , then clear it all.
Typically the major color was painted first followed by the stripe color.
With two toning in basecoat it doesn't really matter which is done first because the clear covers any paint edge.
For your car the decision would be made based on what was the easiest way to mask. For me it would be easier to paint the black first since that would be easier to mask when painting the second color. If you happen to mess up and tape track the black it is also a smaller area to redo before clearing.
Do not mask the black exactly where you want to do the stripe. Spray the black in a larger area, wait the appropriate tape time then lay out the stripe edges exactly before the second color. This gives you only on thickness of paint edge instead of two.
Use 3M precision masking tape for a better edge.
Your paint brand should have a transparent basecoat you can use after masking for the second color. this "seals" the edge of the tape so the second color does not bleed under the tape. This makes a huge difference.
I use PPG but cannot remember the numbers in solvent or water. Used them many times, know right where the can/jug is to grab it but don't remember the number.
 

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Not to tell you what to do, or where you are with the project, but slowly go around the car making sure you have all of the panels lined up like you want and double check for any nicks or flaws in the primer. This would be the time to address any flaws or alignment issues before the final paint is applied. You don't want to be saying, I wish I had addressed this or that. Paint isn't getting any cheaper these days.

Jim
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Thanks Jim. I'm planning to spray the jams, inside the fenders, and underneath the hood and trunk lid. Then reinstall the doors, fenders, hood and trunk lid.

I'm in the process of removing the spray can primer and I have a 2k primer surfacer to cover any scratches and pits.

I also have guide coat to check for low/high spots.

The fenders and doors were lined up pretty good before I removed them and I taped and marked the shims locations.

My intention is to spray it once because I can't afford to paint it again.
 

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Thanks Jim. I'm planning to spray the jams, inside the fenders, and underneath the hood and trunk lid. Then reinstall the doors, fenders, hood and trunk lid.

I'm in the process of removing the spray can primer and I have a 2k primer surfacer to cover any scratches and pits.

I also have guide coat to check for low/high spots.

The fenders and doors were lined up pretty good before I removed them and I taped and marked the shims locations.

My intention is to spray it once because I can't afford to paint it again.
Yep, you only want to do it once and have it last.

It's hard telling in the photo's but using a long board, sand across your gaps to where when this is done and both panel edges are level with each other once it get's painted it will look like the gaps were cut into a solid panel.

This is the reflection you would get with even panel to panel levels (notice how the reflection in the paint goes just right from one panel over to the other):



And this is probably from not blocking across the gaps and having the panels uneven and not level to each other (notice how the reflection is not even from one panel to the next across the gap):



And here is a good panel to panel level, the area's I see that are poor, and then the poor area's not highlighted:







Jim
 

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Lots of good information above. Like stated in above post, do your black first and then do your masking. Be very thorough when your taping and masking the black off. Take extra time when masking the jambs off. The Gold basecoat will like to creep back in between the door to quarter panel, door to fender, and before you know it, you'll have some gold metallic on the black base. I like to make, what i call "dam's" in these areas. I use 3m aperture tape(foam) so that the basecoat cant swirl around in these jambs. There's other tricks and ways to mask it off, but you can use fine line and masking tape too. I also would use blue 3m fine line 1/4" for the final outline of the stripe. This tape will go on after the black base and will stay on until the gold is applied and are ready to clear coat. In between applying the gold basecoats, its a good idea to check on your masking that you did on the black, to make sure corners aren't peeling back. From tacking coats off and the solvents getting on the tape, the tape sometimes rolls back, exposing the black.

Don't be afraid of the gold. yes, they can be tricky, but just maintain a 50 to 60% overlap and you'll do just fine. Golds can sometimes be transparent, and if you feel like you don't know if there is enough basecoat on the panel(s), turn the lights off in the shop, booth, where you are spraying, and take a light, like from your phone or a nice bright LED flashlight and look at the job. If there isn't enough basecoat, you will be able to see through to the sealer and you can apply more paint in those areas. Good luck
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Lots of good information above. Like stated in above post, do your black first and then do your masking. Be very thorough when your taping and masking the black off. Take extra time when masking the jambs off. The Gold basecoat will like to creep back in between the door to quarter panel, door to fender, and before you know it, you'll have some gold metallic on the black base. I like to make, what i call "dam's" in these areas. I use 3m aperture tape(foam) so that the basecoat cant swirl around in these jambs. There's other tricks and ways to mask it off, but you can use fine line and masking tape too. I also would use blue 3m fine line 1/4" for the final outline of the stripe. This tape will go on after the black base and will stay on until the gold is applied and are ready to clear coat. In between applying the gold basecoats, its a good idea to check on your masking that you did on the black, to make sure corners aren't peeling back. From tacking coats off and the solvents getting on the tape, the tape sometimes rolls back, exposing the black.

Don't be afraid of the gold. yes, they can be tricky, but just maintain a 50 to 60% overlap and you'll do just fine. Golds can sometimes be transparent, and if you feel like you don't know if there is enough basecoat on the panel(s), turn the lights off in the shop, booth, where you are spraying, and take a light, like from your phone or a nice bright LED flashlight and look at the job. If there isn't enough basecoat, you will be able to see through to the sealer and you can apply more paint in those areas. Good luck
Thanks lewie415.
I did purchase the 1/4" blue tape. And I have been watching videos and taking notes.
I am making poster boards with instructions for each step from prepping the panels to applying the clear.
I will be checking off each step of the way.

I have been seeing and reading about applying a drop coat for metallic.

Do you suggest a up/down pattern for the sides of the car or just stick with side to side?
 

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Yes you will need a drop coat. You will want to go side to side when doing this. I usually walk the entire car when applying the base and drop coat. When doing the drop coat, increase your gun distance to about 15-18 inches and lower your gun pressure to 17 psi. Take a nice easy coat and your just "fogging " on this coat to orientate the metallics. You can tighten up on the overlap to like 60 to 70% when doing the drop coat. I recommend this for beginners, you'll use a little more paint, but less likely to get the tiger stripes.

https://youtu.be/VUwGZLzJEaw

I'm starting a you tube page, and on here I have a couple videos of a 1931 ford model A that I just cleared. I took a first person video, so this might be helpful to watch. I also have one where I taped up some stripes, but they are a time lapse and I don't explain anything, so the video goes fast.

Are you spraying this in a garage? Also what brand of paint are you using?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I'll watch the video. I'm spraying in a garage so I can control air movement and bugs/dust, etc.
I have Urechem Slick Base Urethane base coat, clear coat, 2K primer surfacer and a sealer.
I bought as a kit.
 

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3M Precision Tape will provide a better line than the blue plastic tape.
If you are spraying base you do not do a drop coat. "Dusting" on a base with this method does not orient the metallic properly, it makes them lay wrong and the color will be off. This would be similar to using a reducer that is too fast on a hot day.
That is an old technique from the single stage days.
Waterbased color with PPG uses something a little similar but water is not for beginners and not for at home.
If your technique is wrong with base, using a drop or changing the direction of your passes will not fix it.
For base all you coats should be the same.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I'm not sure I understand about the drop coat.
Everything I've read or seen says to do a drop coat with metallic.
I'm using a urethane and not a water based.
I've never sprayed a metallic base before so I want to do this right.
 

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You do not use a drop coat with basecoat. Now someone can come on here and say such and such obscure color matches better with a dropcoat, there are occasionally exceptions.
I have sprayed base in collision repair since the 80's and train new painters every year. I/we never use a drop coat for base. I have been thru DuPont and PPG solvent base certification many times, there has been no mention of using drop coats.
I Googled drop coats and found cringeworthy videos from non professionals. One guy is spraying in his basement, another keeps repeating "coverage" and that the base needs to go on wet.
Putting base on too wet causes the problems that make people think they need a drop coat. If your last coat of base is wet enough for a drop coat to"flow in" then your base is way too wet. Fix the technique problem.
One mistake beginners make is applying base too wet because they are looking for the finish shine and coverage in the first coat. Depending on the ingredients (toners) in the paint and the undercoat color, some colors will cover better than others. A general rule is 3 coats will achieve hiding. Using a proper sprayout card and proper spray technique on the card will help determine number of coats for coverage.

PPG DBC500 is the transparent basecoat you can use over you tape edges before spraying the second color. Using this a Precision Tape will virtually eliminate any color bleed thru. The DBC500 will bleed slightly under the tape in a few small spot but because it is transparent you will not see it. The DBC500 seals out the tape edge so the second color will not bleed under.
I sprayed a 2x3 foot panel showing the bleed thru on 4 types of tape with and without transparent base. The 3M Precision with transparent base has perfect, crisp lines. It does not show well in a picture else I would send you one. Your paint company should have a similar product. Some call it clear basecoat but I do not since it confuses beginners who think it is a clearcoat.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
TechNova
This is a metallic gold base and I've watched guys like Kevin Tetz talk about applying a drop coat for metallics.

I'm not going to argue the point because I don't have any experience spraying a metallic. But I have sprayed solid colors and I never applied a drop coat, just did three and done.

I'm using a UreChem SlikBase Urethane in Egyptian Gold Metallic.

I have a Devibliss spray gun kit.

I still have some sanding to do and I just found a leak in my windshield right at the rear view while I was wet sanding. So I've got that to fix too.

Thanks for your replies.
 

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He uses Eastwood, with inferior products there may be a need to cheat.

I am not familiar with your brand what does the tech sheet say to do?
 

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A drop coat application may vary painter to painter. Gun technique and base coat color is going to play a major role in whether one is used or not. The drop coat is not going to hurt anything, in my opinion. It is in fact required in some paint manufacturers. For instance, Sikkens auto base plus and in Sherwin Williams.


Application of Autobase Plus metallic
Spray 2 single coats, at approximately 6 inches from the panel allowing 3–5 minutes flash off
between each coat. Even out the metallic pattern with a metallic orientation coat after the second
coat has flashed off completely. This is achieved by extending the distance between the gun and
panel, and applying a lighter coat.
Do not make this coat too wet. With HVLP equipment, it is not
necessary to lower the pressure, although this may be done in order to control the color.

This is pulled out of Sikkens technical data sheet. Ppg does not state anything about a drop coat in their TDS. I also looked up the paint tech sheet you are using.

Application
Apply 2-4 medium coats using 50-75% overlap (75% overlap is best for lighter colored pearls and
metallics) at a gun distance of 8-10 inches. Equip guns with 1.3-1.5 mm tips and set for 40-55 PSI for
conventional guns or 28-32 PSI for HVLP. For best pearl and metallic orientation walk the entire length
of the sides before overlap to the next stroke. Allow to flash 10-15 min between coats. After final
coat allow to flash at least 30 minutes but no more than 24 hours before application of UreKem 2K
polyurethane clear. For graphic applications Kembase can typically be taped within 1 hour at 70F

It talks about orientation, doesn't say how to "apply" it. Again, gun technique, overlap, reducers, humidity, can all play a role in how base lays down. As long as it looks good before you clear it and you don't have the "tiger stripes" look, the uniform finish is what matters at the end of the day.
 
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