Chevy Nova Forum banner

1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
988 Posts
If you mean the body mount bushings it is not that hard the hardest thing is getting the old bolts broke free from the captive nuts without the cages breaking free. Replace one at a time so you don't lose your subframe alignment and use alot of penetrent keeping soaking for a couple of days if you can.I can't remember which bushing is the rear one and which one is the middle one there is a difference, the core support ones are pretty easy to tell from the other four
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
If you mean the body mount bushings it is not that hard the hardest thing is getting the old bolts broke free from the captive nuts without the cages breaking free. Replace one at a time so you don't lose your subframe alignment and use alot of penetrent keeping soaking for a couple of days if you can.I can't remember which bushing is the rear one and which one is the middle one there is a difference, the core support ones are pretty easy to tell from the other four
Its a set.of solid mounts its the detroit speed ones on classic industries and I wanted to remove the frame from the body so I could get it cleaned up and painted but kinda scary when it comes to the alignment
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
6,502 Posts
It can be easy to screw up or go as smooth as glass.

A story of the bushing replacements on my 74 left me at one point wondering what the heck changed when I went to put on the original fenders.

One thing I'll say right away is save the old parts and mark them as to where they came from and if needed measure what you have to compare to the replacements.

On my 74 I went with the PST polygraphite ones and off memory I think they had directions and I followed them only to find out later on down the road that the original fenders off of the car would no longer fit like they did.

Luckily I kept the old bushings and after putting the original ones back in the fenders lined right up without any problems. I then took the bushings location by location and compared them and found out the firewall base bushings they "said" and "sell" as being replacements were 1/2" thinner in the area between the base of the firewall and the top of the frame mounting ear. This 1/2" difference threw the front of the frame up higher at the radiator support and this then pulls the bottom back edge of the fender away from the rocker sill. There was NO mention of needing to get 1/2" spacers off of a donor car or fabricate my own in the instructions and I had to find this out the hard way.

On the 72 models there is a spacer that from what I've read needs to be reused on this year (and possibly other years) with the new bushings but on my original 74 bushings they were made taller/thicker to where these spacers were not there originally and could not be reused.

On mine since it is still in the mockup stage I bought some large fender type washers like they use in the washers game and stacked them up to get right at 1/2" of thickness and put them on top of the new PST bushings and the bottom of the firewall mount. Eventually on mine I will either make solid one pice spacers or see if PST offers the correct thickness bushings (or may even get a thicker on and have it cut down to the size I need).

Hind sight is always 20/20 and on my other car (a 73 Nova) years ago I replace the bushings and I now think back to the bushings I put in then were probably wrong too as I had a heck of a time getting the fenders to fit right now that I went through the same thing with my 74.

Anyway, make sure what you have matches what you take out.

On my cars I've been lucky to get the bolts to come out and not screw up the captive nuts but some of the bolts had rusted badly to where they were pencil thin and to be safe, got replaced with new grade 5 or grade 8 bolts.

One thing you need to look at is how well the frame is lined up now on the firewall base alignment holes to where later it will be back in the same place with the new bushings.

Jim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
It can be easy to screw up or go as smooth as glass.

A story of the bushing replacements on my 74 left me at one point wondering what the heck changed when I went to put on the original fenders.

One thing I'll say right away is save the old parts and mark them as to where they came from and if needed measure what you have to compare to the replacements.

On my 74 I went with the PST polygraphite ones and off memory I think they had directions and I followed them only to find out later on down the road that the original fenders off of the car would no longer fit like they did.

Luckily I kept the old bushings and after putting the original ones back in the fenders lined right up without any problems. I then took the bushings location by location and compared them and found out the firewall base bushings they "said" and "sell" as being replacements were 1/2" thinner in the area between the base of the firewall and the top of the frame mounting ear. This 1/2" difference threw the front of the frame up higher at the radiator support and this then pulls the bottom back edge of the fender away from the rocker sill. There was NO mention of needing to get 1/2" spacers off of a donor car or fabricate my own in the instructions and I had to find this out the hard way.

On the 72 models there is a spacer that from what I've read needs to be reused on this year (and possibly other years) with the new bushings but on my original 74 bushings they were made taller/thicker to where these spacers were not there originally and could not be reused.

On mine since it is still in the mockup stage I bought some large fender type washers like they use in the washers game and stacked them up to get right at 1/2" of thickness and put them on top of the new PST bushings and the bottom of the firewall mount. Eventually on mine I will either make solid one pice spacers or see if PST offers the correct thickness bushings (or may even get a thicker on and have it cut down to the size I need).

Hind sight is always 20/20 and on my other car (a 73 Nova) years ago I replace the bushings and I now think back to the bushings I put in then were probably wrong too as I had a heck of a time getting the fenders to fit right now that I went through the same thing with my 74.

Anyway, make sure what you have matches what you take out.

On my cars I've been lucky to get the bolts to come out and not screw up the captive nuts but some of the bolts had rusted badly to where they were pencil thin and to be safe, got replaced with new grade 5 or grade 8 bolts.

One thing you need to look at is how well the frame is lined up now on the firewall base alignment holes to where later it will be back in the same place with the new bushings.

Jim
Oh man sounds like a nightmare when I pulled the front end off everything seemed to be good these new mounts have kind of a guide that goes through the frame itself the set I bout seems good but ive never done this kind of job which makes it kind of scary to jump into specialty when the instructions say when installing mounts the frame must be properly aligned in the body using corner to corner as well as front to rear wheel base measurements what suppose to mean haha itsexpected to be off!!
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
6,502 Posts
Oh man sounds like a nightmare when I pulled the front end off everything seemed to be good these new mounts have kind of a guide that goes through the frame itself the set I bout seems good but ive never done this kind of job which makes it kind of scary to jump into specialty when the instructions say when installing mounts the frame must be properly aligned in the body using corner to corner as well as front to rear wheel base measurements what suppose to mean haha itsexpected to be off!!
Let me ask, are you going to be doing this work in one spot ?. On mine I had the car supported off of the ground with some tack welded in supports between the bottom of the car and the garage floor and when I was having this problem I measured from the ground to the top of the frame where the radiator support was at with the old bushings, the new incorrect bushings and then with the incorrect bushings and firewall base spacers so I had a reference number. If I had to guess I'm thinking with the uncorrect new bushings the frame was 1" or more higher at the radiator support area but then once I had the new bushings and my homemade "stack o washers" it was the same with the original bushing and the new setup.

I made a mistake and forgot to check my frame alignment before I took it apart but if it was off originally and now with it in the proper aligned position using the alignment holes I have had no major issues that I can attribute to these possible differences. I have to wonder how close the subframes were in alignment while actually going down the assembly line. They might have found out on lunch break talking to others further on down the line that the frame needs to be tweaked this way or that way a little so other things fell into place better. Who knows sometimes. Sometimes you just have to do what you can but may have to come back to it later to tweak it a little or leave it be and move on.

You might want to get ahold of the factory shop manuals that have the measurements in them and then see how they compare to what you have.

Some people will sell cars saying they have never been hit but then another person finds out they have been. I spent a couple of hours looking over a low mileage 68 Nova I'm picking up this weekend and from what I saw nothing really stood out to make me think it was ever hit BUT with more time I may find out differently. Hopefully I won't find anything. Like they say though, your results may vary.

Jim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Let me ask, are you going to be doing this work in one spot ?. On mine I had the car supported off of the ground with some tack welded in supports between the bottom of the car and the garage floor and when I was having this problem I measured from the ground to the top of the frame where the radiator support was at with the old bushings, the new incorrect bushings and then with the incorrect bushings and firewall base spacers so I had a reference number. If I had to guess I'm thinking with the uncorrect new bushings the frame was 1" or more higher at the radiator support area but then once I had the new bushings and my homemade "stack o washers" it was the same with the original bushing and the new setup.

I made a mistake and forgot to check my frame alignment before I took it apart but if it was off originally and now with it in the proper aligned position using the alignment holes I have had no major issues that I can attribute to these possible differences. I have to wonder how close the subframes were in alignment while actually going down the assembly line. They might have found out on lunch break talking to others further on down the line that the frame needs to be tweaked this way or that way a little so other things fell into place better. Who knows sometimes. Sometimes you just have to do what you can but may have to come back to it later to tweak it a little or leave it be and move on.

You might want to get ahold of the factory shop manuals that have the measurements in them and then see how they compare to what you have.

Some people will sell cars saying they have never been hit but then another person finds out they have been. I spent a couple of hours looking over a low mileage 68 Nova I'm picking up this weekend and from what I saw nothing really stood out to make me think it was ever hit BUT with more time I may find out differently. Hopefully I won't find anything. Like they say though, your results may vary.

Jim
Yeah its going to be done in one spot and what I was thinking to do is where its bolted right now I can sandblast around the frame leave it bare metal on the body and spray paint or take a sharpie and draw around were the body and frame should meet and adjust it accordingly if even needed? Sounds like it will work kinda haha and ill be using the alignment holes so sounds kind of easy
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,035 Posts
I just changed my body mounts on my 69. I jacked up one side and did it, then I jacked up the other side and did it. This way the subframe stays in place and stays in line. Its easy if the old bolts come out, and whatever you do dont through away the 1/2 inch spacres at the firewall. The bolts at the firewall are also longer that the back subframe bolts. Keep that in mind if you buy new subframe bolts. :yes:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I just changed my body mounts on my 69. I jacked up one side and did it, then I jacked up the other side and did it. This way the subframe stays in place and stays in line. Its easy if the old bolts come out, and whatever you do dont through away the 1/2 inch spacres at the firewall. The bolts at the firewall are also longer that the back subframe bolts. Keep that in mind if you buy new subframe bolts. :yes:
I though about doing that but I wanted to remove the frame so I could paint it any more ideas
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,035 Posts
I though about doing that but I wanted to remove the frame so I could paint it any more ideas

Im sorry about that you did say you wanted to paint the frame. I guess it depends on what kind of a job you want on the paint if you were to leave it on the body and paint it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Im sorry about that you did say you wanted to paint the frame. I guess it depends on what kind of a job you want on the paint if you were to leave it on the body and paint it.
Was looking to take it and have it powder coated thats why I was trying to find out how it is before I jumped into it
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,035 Posts
Was looking to take it and have it powder coated thats why I was trying to find out how it is before I jumped into it
I dont think you will have any problems. Before you put take the body off measure where its sitting on the subframe and put it back in the same place. It should go good for you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
I dont think you will have any problems. Before you put take the body off measure where its sitting on the subframe and put it back in the same place. It should go good for you.
Yeah I was hoping it wouldnt be too hard yeah ill do that measure up everything
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
31,194 Posts
They were way easier then I expected when I replaced the ones in my car. I think the hardest part was supporting the body safely without damaging it while I lifted it to remove and install the bushings. Just do 2 at a time and you shouldn't disturb the original alignment, but measurements are always good insurance!:yes:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
They were way easier then I expected when I replaced the ones in my car. I think the hardest part was supporting the body safely without damaging it while I lifted it to remove and install the bushings. Just do 2 at a time and you shouldn't disturb the original alignment, but measurements are always good insurance!:yes:
So it would be safer to forget about painting the frame?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
31,194 Posts
So it would be safer to forget about painting the frame?
It would be, but it would be nice painted up, measure the frame up now and paint it out!:yes: There are dowel holes to help align sub frame at the firewall too. My frame was already painted or POR-15.

It is easier to remove the front springs with the frame still under the car though.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,035 Posts
I sure wouldnt take the subframe off just to paint it. If the subframe had to come out for some reason yeah its a given to paint it or powder coat it. It can be painted and touched up to look decent in the car. The worst part of puting new subframe bushings in is hoping the old bolts come out other than that its easy. I had one bolt that was a pain to get out at the firewall even heat wouldnt help, so I had to cut it out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
It would be, but it would be nice painted up, measure the frame up now and paint it out!:yes: There are dowel holes to help align sub frame at the firewall too. My frame was already painted or POR-15.

It is easier to remove the front springs with the frame still under the car though.
Yeah kinda makes me nervous with the whole alignment thing though ill probably just bow up and jump into it and just be careful as possible and hope for the best haha freshly painted frame over and under sound worth doing the job
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
205 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
:(
I sure wouldnt take the subframe off just to paint it. If the subframe had to come out for some reason yeah its a given to paint it or powder coat it. It can be painted and touched up to look decent in the car. The worst part of puting new subframe bushings in is hoping the old bolts come out other than that its easy. I had one bolt that was a pain to get out at the firewall even heat wouldnt help, so I had to cut it out.
Yeah those bolts seem like their gonna be a pain im gonna spray them down with some deep creep by seafoam stuff is excellent better than pb blaster and it should loosen up
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
Top