It's been a long time since I drove a front-drums brake car

As a recently re-acquainted owner to the pleasure of Novas, I have come to the realization of a couple of lessons:

1) Front-drummed Novas don't come to a halt as powered-disk brakes and ABS.:eek:

2) Novas, were not born Corvettes.:(

My dad's 1971 Acadian had front drums.

http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1ppsvlS95gX85BkvAcpvSAjmqktM3Wn1KLOmOIsdXkqlRK_L5 e38aN-V1DA7e-mj2IumDB_7nrfGo


And I drove it every weekend with no problems. But after 29 Years driving a Corvette, a 1976 2dr Nova, a 1989 Jeep Cherokee, a 1993 F-150, and a 1998 Diamante (with ABS), the feel of my new Acadian's brakes really awoke my fears. I did have a 1962 VW Ragtop which had drum brakes as well, but I owned it when I bought my Vette, and I found myself driving my VW less and less over time.

So, the way I see it I have three options:

1) Leave it the way it is and get a fresh brake job done on all 4-wheels.

2) Keep the drums, but replace the cylinder with a booster unit.

3) Replace the front drums wit a disk upgrade.

So I know you can see my question now -which would be the best option as far as originality and braking improvement?

I would like to hear everyone's opinions, but specially, I would like to hear from members who made the switch but love it or regret it, OR from members who think that adding the booster to the drum brake system would be better or worse. Thanks for your inputs.

GerryLP:cool:

http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1ppsvlS95gX86FUTKpF_uTOfEOUdJxEqBIRTeQVLVRMWev1Z6 X3i8hyRyweJVKiiKonsvAHHBL3Gc

Well, that depends on what you want to do with the car. If you want originality, the drums are the only way to go. Same goes if you want to show the car in a stock class. Looks like you are into the show scene with your nice car trailer. :) If sticking with the drums I'd do an upgrade with semi-metallic shoes, and look at the drums to see if they need re-surfacing. Also look at the brake lines for bulges or cracks. If the drums are adjusted right, they work pretty darn well.

If you drive the car go with the disc conversion, at least in the front. Drum brakes are good for 1 or 2 hard stops, then seem to soften after that. So stop and go traffic, or driving bumper to bumper at 70 mph can get interesting with drums! :eek:

Well, that depends on what you want to do with the car. If you want originality, the drums are the only way to go. Same goes if you want to show the car in a stock class. Looks like you are into the show scene with your nice car trailer. :) If sticking with the drums I'd do an upgrade with semi-metallic shoes, and look at the drums to see if they need re-surfacing. Also look at the brake lines for bulges or cracks. If the drums are adjusted right, they work pretty darn well.

If you drive the car go with the disc conversion, at least in the front. Drum brakes are good for 1 or 2 hard stops, then seem to soften after that. So stop and go traffic, or driving bumper to bumper at 70 mph can get interesting with drums! :eek:

Lt,

That rig belongs to Russ Transport who brought me the car at the end of March.

I do want to show the car locally, but I do plan to drive it long distances (such as 63Pro's shindig in September). Right now, I do not plan to keep it 100% stock, for I know what a pain that is from experience with my Vette. But, it does have the original 307 engine and the original Power-Glide tranny, so I plan to leave those where they are at.

I am concerned with dropping the 4,000 feet west of Flag Staff, AZ on drum brakes. And like you said, they could only be good for 1 or 2 emergency stops.

What do you think about adding a brake booster to the master cylinder?

GerryLP:cool:

I added disk brakes from a 1973 Nova to my 68. I didn't add the booster, I just went with manual disk brakes. The change was huge and was one of the best upgrades I have done. It stops so much better and doesn't dive for the ditch when you put on the brakes.

IMO, if your thinking about adding a booster on a car that didn't come with one, that takes away from the originality just as much as adding disc brakes.
If it was me, I'd go with the power disc conversion.
Just keep all of the original parts packed away so ya have them if you ever decide to go for a full on resto back to stock.

Lt1Nova / Nova Guy / Klean 63,

Thank you for the responses. I am sold!

So, how do I go about getting either an aftermarket set OR a donor car?

I mean, the aftermarket set is guaranteed to be new, but a donor car would have 30+ year old parts...right? Or do you know a particular business who sells GM-true upgrade kit?

I have seen the ones in eBay, but would that be worth it?

GerryLP:cool:

CPP, Stainless Steel Brake Corp, Master Power Brake....., the list goes on. Shop around for the most complete bolt on kit.

pm sent:D

I'm got the SSBC disc conversion kit (bought it from a fellow Steve's member). Haven't put it on yet (hope to in the next month) but just looking at it is SWEET. :cool:
http://www.ssbrakes.com/products/detail/388/?make=Chevrolet&model=Nova&year=1969

There is no way I'd drive around with drum brakes around here in the Seattle area. Too many people on their cell phones drinkin' Starbucks and not PAYING ATTENTION. :mad:

I don't know about those e-bay 'kits'. Like it was said before, make sure it is as complete as you can get.

putting power disc brakes on my 72 was the best modification i have done to the car the difference in the stopping distance is amazing i used junk yard spindles new lines and a new booster.

I added disk brakes from a 1973 Nova to my 68. I didn't add the booster, I just went with manual disk brakes. The change was huge and was one of the best upgrades I have done. It stops so much better and doesn't dive for the ditch when you put on the brakes.


What's this about diving for the ditch? My 74 has drums and discs and currently jerks to the right when I apply the brakes. I havn't gotten round to messin with the brakes yet (All engine and suspension work:devil::devil:) I figure I have to at least get new shoes and pads and bleed the lines, but is there something else?

If your car is diving for the ditch when you hit the brakes, it isn't because of the type of brakes you have. You need to check the system and adjust properly.

I currently have four wheel manual drums and it stops just fine with no diving or pulling. It just takes Superman legs... :)

What's this about diving for the ditch? My 74 has drums and discs and currently jerks to the right when I apply the brakes. I havn't gotten round to messin with the brakes yet (All engine and suspension work:devil::devil:) I figure I have to at least get new shoes and pads and bleed the lines, but is there something else?
On mine the problem was the lower a-arm bushings were worn out that caused it to dive for the ditch. The drums brakes had some kind of problem also. One of the front brakes would always lock before the other one.
The best drum brakes are still not very good.

I added disk brakes from a 1973 Nova to my 68. I didn't add the booster, I just went with manual disk brakes. The change was huge and was one of the best upgrades I have done. It stops so much better and doesn't dive for the ditch when you put on the brakes.


Nova_Guy: What's your pedal pressure like? I'd like disc on the front but don't want a giant tumor on the firewall.

Pedal pressure isn't bad at all. It isn't as easy as a power brake car of course but it is very driveable. My 70 Camaro came with manual disk brakes and a buddy of mine had a 73 Cutlass the same way. GM make and sold them that way so it isn't a crazy way of doing it. The pedal has two holes in it for the rod into the back of the mastser cylinder. I forget which hole you use, but it puts more leverage against the master cylinder. Your kit or an assembly manual will say which hole to use when you get to that point.

Thanks for the info. I'll have to look into that option.

So, the way I see it I have three options:

1) Leave it the way it is and get a fresh brake job done on all 4-wheels.

2) Keep the drums, but replace the cylinder with a booster unit.

3) Replace the front drums wit a disk upgrade.

So I know you can see my question now -which would be the best option as far as originality and braking improvement?





1. Good brake are always needed. but drum brakes are just that! DRUM!

2. A booster will not improve the stopping power of the car.

3. I installed 4 wheel disc on my car. And it has been the best the very best money spent on my car. I HAVE SAID IT BEFORE!
they are not power, it will stop quick!

There is no need for power brakes, I can tell you it's only a convenience.

There are a lot of brake company's out there.
And I know of no problems with any of them.

I went with the Brake kit from Master Power Brake.
Other than the company being close, the system they have uses factory based parts. So when brake job comes up I can get service parts at any parts store. They are a manufacture and not a re-box company and there support staff is outstanding.
http://www.mpbrakes.com/

IMO and based on my exsperance.
MIN: and first choice install front disc brakes.
And what I would do first and at a min.

If I can help let me know.

Al

Wow guys! I spent the entire day wrenching on my Acadian (didn't get as far as I hoped, though:( ), and I am glad to find this interesting discussion going-on.

I suspect that driving modern vehicles and sensing the difference between drums, disc, power discs, and ABS is natural.

I will try the disc upgrade first (thanks BigAl, Nova Guy and Klean63 :thumbsup:), and I am not sure if power-brakes were available in 71, but that tumor (to quote Photoman...very funny:yes:) does give you the stopping power necessary. My Vette has the tumor, and works like a charm.

I think that I'll try the disc convert first, and then I'll install the booster, but the fact is that my car has only a 307 V8, so as long as I can slow down the car coming down from the mountains, then I am ok with that performance. The gross 200 Hp on my 307 won't break any records...:D:D:D:D:D

GerryLP:cool:

I can only imagine my nova with disk brakes. I still have manual drums all the way around with no power booster. Wanting to upgrade to disks sooooo bad but money's kinda the issue. I mean when isn't it. lol
:D Good luck with your decision.

I've been going in circles for two days trying to get my booster/MC combo the work right and I'm thinking of going back to a non-boosted system. I am encouraged to hear the disks work fine with no booster.

Dave

Hey guys (and gals),

Guess what?! I received my shop manual today (original 1971 chassis service manual).

Inside the front cover (backside of front cover), it has attached a publication-original note stating that this manual is the same one for the 1971 Camaro, and that the Camaro name was omitted from the cover and title page by error, and BLING!!!!!! the light came on....

I have parked in my yard a 1971 Camaro with a non-original 400 engine which my sister-in-law gave me back in 2004. She wanted out of her storage agreement and paid me to go get it in California. Coincidentally, I had bought my 1993 F-150 truck from my friend Dale, and he had moved to California, so to make a long story short, I hauled it home with my F-150.

http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1ppsvlS95gX86DjcyzgW6LRdvk6jcvQ8WS3qVM-FCzZFVzfOnBm5ywcVUJUROmvoOSVXEQ_LS8WtE

http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1ppsvlS95gX84Ad1YqCpAbe17MC7c_I1pVPEG6rIh_vtC4nAx 3SWzjSfojJvZsUGdrI1qhpbfhlKM

Well, I peeked under the Camaro, and it has the front disk brakes set-up!!! I plan to clean/inspect/repair/replace whatever I can find from the Camaro brake set-up, and I will install it on my Acadian!

The Camaro would need tons of money to overhaul, and I would give it to my brother Leslie, who's a Camaro buff, but I doubt that he would want to mess with it or haul it to Puerto Rico. I think that I will sell it piece by piece in eBay...:D:D

So thanks for all the great input. I am tempted to turn-in the different parts of the brake system as cores, and get new ones from Autozone. I should get a conversion done under $150 dollars (and a lot of sweat...:(:mad::rolleyes::D).

GerryLP:cool:

If it's gonna be a driver, I'd go with the power front disc swap. I run a local speed shop here and I've installed about every major brand out there. IMO you get the biggest bang for your buck with Classic Performance Products. It's a full bolt on kit with all matched parts and it looks factory. They use GM brake pads too so you don't have to order special pads when you do the brakes.

Thanks for the info Al. I'm for sure going to go with manual disc brakes. I don't like the tumor and I'll probably end up with a hairy cam later on and don't want to worry about idle vacuum.

I've been told by some of our members that CPP are the way to go. I was at their website today window shopping...:D:D:D

GerryLP:cool:

Hey guys (and gals),

Guess what?! I received my shop manual today (original 1971 chassis service manual).

Inside the front cover (backside of front cover), it has attached a publication-original note stating that this manual is the same one for the 1971 Camaro, and that the Camaro name was omitted from the cover and title page by error, and BLING!!!!!! the light came on....

I have parked in my yard a 1971 Camaro with a non-original 400 engine which my sister-in-law gave me back in 2004. She wanted out of her storage agreement and paid me to go get it in California. Coincidentally, I had bought my 1993 F-150 truck from my friend Dale, and he had moved to California, so to make a long story short, I hauled it home with my F-150.

http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1ppsvlS95gX86DjcyzgW6LRdvk6jcvQ8WS3qVM-FCzZFVzfOnBm5ywcVUJUROmvoOSVXEQ_LS8WtE

http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1ppsvlS95gX84Ad1YqCpAbe17MC7c_I1pVPEG6rIh_vtC4nAx 3SWzjSfojJvZsUGdrI1qhpbfhlKM

Well, I peeked under the Camaro, and it has the front disk brakes set-up!!! I plan to clean/inspect/repair/replace whatever I can find from the Camaro brake set-up, and I will install it on my Acadian!

The Camaro would need tons of money to overhaul, and I would give it to my brother Leslie, who's a Camaro buff, but I doubt that he would want to mess with it or haul it to Puerto Rico. I think that I will sell it piece by piece in eBay...:D:D

So thanks for all the great input. I am tempted to turn-in the different parts of the brake system as cores, and get new ones from Autozone. I should get a conversion done under $150 dollars (and a lot of sweat...:(:mad::rolleyes::D).

GerryLP:cool:

Awesome! Always good to save a dime here and there when you can. If you want to keep the camaro rollable, you'll have to either get new spindles for your Acadian or modify the stock ones from what I gather.

On a side note My neighbor is restoring a same Gen Camaro and I know he needs, at the least, a front clip. Let me know What all you're wanting to get rid of and i'll talk to him. Maybe we'll go check it out. I'd also like to see your Acadian, it looks nice in the pictures. I live on the westside of ABQ.

Well, I peeked under the Camaro, and it has the front disk brakes set-up!!! I plan to clean/inspect/repair/replace whatever I can find from the Camaro brake set-up, and I will install it on my Acadian!I don't think anything will work. The Camaro spindals are different.

I don't think anything will work. The Camaro spindals are different.

Nova Guy...aaawww.:eek:..why? :confused:

GerryLP:cool: