Potential 78 Rally found. Help verify?

[reo78rally]

Everyone probably saw this one before, but can someone help with the verification?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Chevy-Nova-Rally_W0QQitemZ110009532555QQihZ001QQcategoryZ6172 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I'm goin to get her if its right..
Rich

[jade76]

Well, according to the cowl tag, it is a 78, but it doesn't have the RPO26 code anywhere on it, it's just a clone. Also, all 78 Rally's have the 3 pc Custom/Concours Taillights since in 78 the Rally could only be ordered with Custom option.

Rally wouldn't have side trim either. Take a look at my 78, it's rough looking but 100% original:

My 78 Rally (http://www.gen4novas.com/gallery2/view_album.asp?Ad_ID=38&CatLevel=3&Cat1_ID=4&Cat2_ID=3&Cat3_ID=&Cat4_ID=&FromSearch=True&SearchPage=%2Fgallery2%2Fdefault%2Easp%3FCatLevel% 3D3%26Cat1%5FID%3D4%26Cat2%5FID%3D3)

I'll get some pics of my cowl tag tomorrow so you can see what I'm referring to with the RPO26 code on them. All original factory Rally's will have it.

[reo78rally]

Are you sure about the 3 piece tail light requirement? I've seen a lot of Rally's with the matching stripes from the sides on the back next to the license plate. With the standard 2 pice tail light.

[jade76]

Positive, or at least that's what I have learned at this site and from others so far! 77 Rally's had 2 piece taillights, but all 78's had 3 pc. As mentioned, in 78 the Rally could only be ordered factory with Custom option which was only available with 3pc taillights. And the cowl tag would also have actual letters "RPO26" on the 3rd line.

[reo78rally]

How about this one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1978-NOVA-RALLY-CHEVY-TRUE-RALLY-PROJECT-CAR-W-EXTRAS_W0QQitemZ270010979735QQihZ017QQcategoryZ617 2QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[jade76]

I don't think it's a true Rally either, probably just a standard Custom turned clone.
The VIN # 1Y27U8W193103 indicates it to be a Custom, which it will have the 3pc taillight. Again, the cowl tag doesn't have the RPO26 any where on it. It's hard to say sometimes since anything could have been done to that car in the past 30 years to make it look like a Rally. Custom would've had chrome trim on rockers and hood, but that could've easilly have all been removed and holes filled in and stripes added.

All the true Rally's I've seen had red interior (not that they can't be different), but I think it was a general rule then, and the Customs had tan interior as his description states it was originally.

Here's a couple more links for identifying: SS/Rally Identification (http://www.gen4novas.com/cat_content.asp?catid=421) Cowl Tag Codes (http://www.gen4novas.com/cat.asp?catid=420&contenttypeid=)

[jade76]

He does state to have the title, so you could always buy it and do some research, try to find the original owner of that car. All the previous owner's should be listed on the title, unless a lost title was applied for and it's not the original.

I'd still be wary of the RPO26 code not being on the cowl tag though, especially if you're looking for a true Rally! Anybody can put a grille, emblems and striped on one and call it a Rally, but the cowl tag code doesn't lie.

[==sYc==>]

Well, according to the cowl tag, it is a 78, but it doesn't have the RPO26 code anywhere on it, it's just a clone.
That's not true. First, the Rally code is RPO-Z26 and it would appear on the build sheet, not the cowl tag. Some cowl tags might have it but that are the exception, not the rule.

Also, all 78 Rally's have the 3 pc Custom/Concours Taillights since in 78 the Rally could only be ordered with Custom option.
That is also wrong. The Rally was available on both the standard (coupe and hatchback) and Custom (coupe only) Novas.

[==sYc==>]

I don't think it's a true Rally either, probably just a standard Custom turned clone.
All the true Rally's I've seen had red interior (not that they can't be different), but I think it was a general rule then, and the Customs had tan interior as his description states it was originally.

Here's a couple more links for identifying: SS/Rally Identification (http://www.gen4novas.com/cat_content.asp?catid=421)
You are wrong. Look at the page you posted:
http://www.gen4novas.com/cat_content.asp?contentid=188&catid=421

You will see it lists:

1978 Nova Rally - RPO Z26

Model Availability

Standard Nova hatchback - 1X17
Standard Nova coupe - 1X27
Custom Nova coupe - 1Y27

[jade76]

So I forgot the "Z", either way neither of the cowl's have the code.

That's not true. First, the Rally code is RPO-Z26 and it would appear on the build sheet, not the cowl tag. Some cowl tags might have it but that are the exception, not the rule.

Quote:
Also, all 78 Rally's have the 3 pc Custom/Concours Taillights since in 78 the Rally could only be ordered with Custom option.

That is also wrong. The Rally was available on both the standard (coupe and hatchback) and Custom (coupe only) Novas.


Can you verify that? Every true 78 Rally I've seen has had the RPO-Z26 code stamped on the cowl tag, including mine, and has the Custom taillights, except for the 77 and 79 Rally. I agree that the build sheet, if it still exists in the car, does list all the options that were included with the car from the factory and will 100% verify it, but cowl tag also lists every option that car came with.

[69NovaSS]

but cowl tag also lists every option that car came with.

Well I know squat about 4th gen cars but this is not true for 3rd gen cars and I dont think this is true for the first and second gen cars either or ID'ing L79's etc would be much eaiser then most people make it out to be:)

[jade76]

The main thing reo78, if you can't verify the RPO-Z26 code, there's probably a 99% chance that it's a clone. If what ==sYc==> is true, then the only way to verify is it is the build sheet as he mentioned, and it's more than likely been tossed when the car was stripped down if the owner didn't know what it was.

I'm pretty sure that if my Rally has the RPO-Z26 stamped right on the cowl tag, then all of them would have been, as I have seen with others. Logically thinking, the factory would have stamped them all the same. They would not waste the time to stamp one with the code and the next without it.

Not that I can't be wrong on this, just think reasonably on it. Many people would love to have a true SS or Rally and will do their best to clone and pass their car off as true, just because a true factory SS and Rally are rare, but also difficult to identify.

I can say my 76SS doesn't have any code on the cowl tag, but that's a whole different production year, and story. It's even possible they didn't put the RPO-Z26 on 77, but started in 78, or one plant to the next. If that's the case, then you'll never know for sure. But as mentioned, I have no doubt my 78 is true Rally with the RPO-Z26 stamped right on the cowl. On my 76 SS, I have no doubt it's a true SS only because the original fenders do not have any holes for emblems, and were not filled in, and has the F-40 suspension which is the only indication on it without a build sheet.

[bbdon]

There was more than one assembly plant building the Novas, and each plant tended to have it's own standards for cowl tag stamping. I think that both of the ebay listings linked here are probably genuine Rally optioned cars. I have not seen a big problem with clones on 4th gen Novas yet. The rally option only adds a few hundred to the resale value anyway.

[==sYc==>]

Can you verify that? Every true 78 Rally I've seen has had the RPO-Z26 code stamped on the cowl tag, including mine, and has the Custom taillights, except for the 77 and 79 Rally.
Straight from the 1978 bruchure:

Nova Rally Equipment Includes diamond-pattern chrome-plated grille and black headlight bexels with bright trim and horizontally mounted parking lights. Also. triple band striping and colored-keyed Rally wheels. Wheels have bright trim rings, lug nuts and center caps. Special "Nova Rally" identification on grille and front fenders. Available on Nova and Nova Custom, Coupe and Hatchback models

http://www.classicnovas.net/brochure/78nv-11.jpg

but cowl tag also lists every option that car came with.
wrong

[reo78rally]

Guys,
I really didn't mean to cause such an uproar. I know that there are some high emotions here about it, and I can say for myself, when my Rally was mentioned as a possible non Rally, I got a little worried and upset myself.
The build sheet is the ONLY way to know if any of these are for sure Rally or not.

The 4th gen nova's did not carry enough clout, such as Corvettes or Camaro's, to warrant close scrutiny and id verification at the time.

If an owner picked up his Rally from the dealer, he looked at the stripes, the badges, the grille, and finally, when he/she paid, they would for sure look at the INVOICE. The build sheet was on the window, probably scratched off and tossed. Did they put the other copy under the seat like so many other cars?

I hope that people can remember, that we're only going off of information that we think is correct. And its always good to remember the possibility, that we could be wrong. I know that some of us may have more knowledge than others, but we are all just car guys that love our cars. Non of us worked at the factory at the time, (if any of you did, I would like to talk to you). Please lets not use words that may come accross as harsh or accusational.

I have to admit, a 4th gen nova wasn't my first choice when I was buying that 76 SS with my dad 20-some years ago, but I fell in love with it for the good times I had fixing it up, and the experiences I had with it, good and bad. Eventually I came to appreciate it for what it is.

So, I'm looking at my Rally, and it brings back memories from days gone by.
I'm probably going to get another one in a few days, with my son, and I hope to create memories for him, much the same as I had with my dad.

Rally, true or not, the cars are fun. Value, only intrinsic to me after today.

Some other makes and models with different optoins are definately more valuable than clones. Some people are hung up on monitary value, and that these cars only have value if they are original with the correct options.

Up until today, I believed that somewhat as well. My 76 SS hatchback, 3spd, 305, blue. How many were made with those options. Probably not very many. I used to think that I was hung up on that car because of the options, the value. But I think now I miss the car for the times I had with it, not the model, the optoins, the rarity. It certainly doesn't hurt, but its not the only thing. The car is gone, but now I know the memories are forever. I took pictures, I tell stories, I post it on sites like this, it lives on.

[jade76]

reo78rally Guys,
I really didn't mean to cause such an uproar. I know that there are some high emotions here about it, and I can say for myself, when my Rally was mentioned as a possible non Rally, I got a little worried and upset myself.
The build sheet is the ONLY way to know if any of these are for sure Rally or not.

The 4th gen nova's did not carry enough clout, such as Corvettes or Camaro's, to warrant close scrutiny and id verification at the time.

If an owner picked up his Rally from the dealer, he looked at the stripes, the badges, the grille, and finally, when he/she paid, they would for sure look at the INVOICE. The build sheet was on the window, probably scratched off and tossed. Did they put the other copy under the seat like so many other cars?

I hope that people can remember, that we're only going off of information that we think is correct. And its always good to remember the possibility, that we could be wrong. I know that some of us may have more knowledge than others, but we are all just car guys that love our cars. Non of us worked at the factory at the time, (if any of you did, I would like to talk to you). Please lets not use words that may come accross as harsh or accusational.

I have to admit, a 4th gen nova wasn't my first choice when I was buying that 76 SS with my dad 20-some years ago, but I fell in love with it for the good times I had fixing it up, and the experiences I had with it, good and bad. Eventually I came to appreciate it for what it is.

So, I'm looking at my Rally, and it brings back memories from days gone by.
I'm probably going to get another one in a few days, with my son, and I hope to create memories for him, much the same as I had with my dad.

Rally, true or not, the cars are fun. Value, only intrinsic to me after today.

Some other makes and models with different optoins are definately more valuable than clones. Some people are hung up on monitary value, and that these cars only have value if they are original with the correct options.

Up until today, I believed that somewhat as well. My 76 SS hatchback, 3spd, 305, blue. How many were made with those options. Probably not very many. I used to think that I was hung up on that car because of the options, the value. But I think now I miss the car for the times I had with it, not the model, the optoins, the rarity. It certainly doesn't hurt, but its not the only thing. The car is gone, but now I know the memories are forever. I took pictures, I tell stories, I post it on sites like this, it lives on.

Well said! 4th Gens as of yet have no real value one way or the other, just that the SS and Rally seem to be the more popular, regardless of what Chevy model it is.

However, it's good that people ask questions and debates come about, that's how we learn the facts since obviously they're not readily available for us as you stated with other models, and many people may have different opinions and/or facts about them that we are not yet aware of. That's what make this site so great, we can post our questions and knowledge, and agree or disagree to come to our own conclusions.

[dzrallynova]

I have a 1978 rally 4sp hatchback bought in 1984 from 1st owner it has the two piece taillights starting to restore it also in 78 you could not get a 350 with the 4sd had to be a 305

[reo78rally]

Hey DZ
What's your Rally colors? Does your cowl tag have the RPO z26?
Got some pictures?

[jade76]

Ok, the info I got about 78 Rally having to be Custom came from a friend who read it in a Chevy Reference Book that he still has. According to him it states in it the Z26 option could only be ordered with the Custom Package. I'm going to get the name of that book, year it was printed and try to get a photocopy of the page to post it to clear this matter up.

So far, everbody here is going off hear-say and a couple articles that are vague in description and have no specifics. Lets see some articles or proof with specific and definite facts, such as a build sheet from a 78 Rally with the double taillights or the Z26 code on the cowl tag! Or perhaps we could even all post photos of our Rally cowl tags to compare production plant, body and interior options, etc. This could help us to differentiate from the different production plants and establish a real basis on what was truly available. It may not be of real concern, but many of us would also like to answer that one question, "Is our Rally truly an original factory Z26?"

As for mine, it has the Z26 code right on the cowl tag, so there's no question, but many here apparently do not have that and we can only guess without something to compare it to.

I think I'll start a thread for that, and my friend is an even bigger 4th Gen nut than I am, and has several reference books to help decode them if anybody is interested.

[==sYc==>]

Ok, the info I got about 78 Rally having to be Custom came from a friend who read it in a Chevy Reference Book that he still has. According to him it states in it the Z26 option could only be ordered with the Custom Package. I'm going to get the name of that book, year it was printed and try to get a photocopy of the page to post it to clear this matter up.
Either the book is wrong or he read it wrong.

So far, everbody here is going off hear-say and a couple articles that are vague in description and have no specifics. Lets see some articles or proof with specific and definite facts, such as a build sheet from a 78 Rally with the double taillights or the Z26 code on the cowl tag!

How is the 1978 Nova brochure vague? It clearly states that it was available on both standard Novas (2-lens tail lights) and Custom Novas (3-lens tail lights):

http://www.classicnovas.net/brochure/78nv-11.jpg

[jade76]

==sYc==> Quote:
Originally Posted by jade76
Ok, the info I got about 78 Rally having to be Custom came from a friend who read it in a Chevy Reference Book that he still has. According to him it states in it the Z26 option could only be ordered with the Custom Package. I'm going to get the name of that book, year it was printed and try to get a photocopy of the page to post it to clear this matter up.

Either the book is wrong or he read it wrong.


And on what basis and proof do you have to back that up, because the brochure says so? If the book is presumably wrong as you say, then what's to say the brochure isn't misprinted too? You're going to have to do better than that.

I started a thread for posting cowl tags and build sheets to break down the code and determine facts from hear-say.

[==sYc==>]

And on what basis and proof do you have to back that up, because the brochure says so? If the book is presumably wrong as you say, then what's to say the brochure isn't misprinted too? You're going to have to do better than that.
Because the brochure was written and printed in 1977 when the car was being sold unlike this book which was written many years after the Nova was discontinued.

Besides, you posted a link to a webpage that clearly shows the Rally was available on the standard Nova:
I don't think it's a true Rally either, probably just a standard Custom turned clone.
The VIN # 1Y27U8W193103 indicates it to be a Custom, which it will have the 3pc taillight. Again, the cowl tag doesn't have the RPO26 any where on it. It's hard to say sometimes since anything could have been done to that car in the past 30 years to make it look like a Rally. Custom would've had chrome trim on rockers and hood, but that could've easilly have all been removed and holes filled in and stripes added.

All the true Rally's I've seen had red interior (not that they can't be different), but I think it was a general rule then, and the Customs had tan interior as his description states it was originally.

Here's a couple more links for identifying: SS/Rally Identification (http://www.gen4novas.com/cat_content.asp?contentid=188&catid=421)

You're mistaken. Accept it and move on.

[dzrallynova]

my nova is carmine with orange stripes, it has black int. bench seat, the car has its original paint.as i said before i am the 2nd owner since 1984,as far as the cowl tag it does not have the z26 stamped on it I will try to send pics later.

[Green Dragon]

, but cowl tag also lists every option that car came with.

hate to add to the 'argument' :geek: m but that is incorrect - the cowl tag lists ONLY items that mattered to Fisher Body when building the shells, NOT items that would be added later.

ie: if bucket seats or 4 speed, the shell needed the right cutouts or brackets, so it's on there.

but, items like guage package, or posi-traction, or other interiror type items would not be shown on the cowl tag.

This has been long verified by studies of info by other groups, and applies to ALL GM tags,regardless of model.

~ AL

[Green Dragon]

. It's even possible they didn't put the RPO-Z26 on 77, but started in 78, or one plant to the next. .

very possible a palnt to plant thing as Tony mentioned.

I know, for instance, somce 69 Z28 have cowl id, some do not, depending on where built,etc.

as for the cars questioned, # 1 looks like a possible clone but hard to tell ( and I agree with Tony, that EVERY 78 Rally I've seen had the 3 light tailights, coincidence ? )
the second, rougher, car looks legit - why would someone go to the troubel of faking a car that rough ? , stripes look original and faded,etc.

I also note the cowl tag has those 'dots' ... as Tony's, which I don't recall seeing before.. going to have to huit my pile of cowl tags and look-see.

~ AL

[hdheritage1]

I also note the cowl tag has those 'dots' ... as Tony's, which I don't recall seeing before.. going to have to huit my pile of cowl tags and

going to buy a 78 rally tomorro and came across the three dot thing on this one
on the 3rd line towards the center it hs an R followed by three dots

R . . . also the tail ligts in the reverse lens has a scripted C. does that stand for concourse or custom?

[Green Dragon]

going to buy a 78 rally tomorro and came across the three dot thing on this one
on the 3rd line towards the center it hs an R followed by three dots

R . . . also the tail ligts in the reverse lens has a scripted C. does that stand for concourse or custom?

well, this was never cleared up or resolved.. I;m a numbers guy ( get that from my dad, although he used to build Chevelles more than Novas ).
same with Tony ( is he still around ? been a few months since I was on the board here, due to various personal issues,etc ) ....

anyways - my 2 1/2 cents is the R with dots, seems to be something consistent with the Rally tags we've seen and is a good sign, although not foolproof.

Definately pull the car apart and look for a build sheet , personally I;ve found them under back seats, taped to the top of the headliner, more than once taped to the backside of a doorpanel ( in fact, passenger doorpanel is where my 77 rally sheet was found, 15 years after I bought it, proving it was,indeed, a clone ).

I saw the pics of your car, and it certainly looks to be legit, so worth both building, and investigating further, as noted - the build sheets is the ONLY definitive proof.

~ AL

[Novajay]

Al,

Haven't seen Tony in a while. Probably since he was moving from Georgia to Wisconsin, I think. He was talking about selling what 4th gens he had, so I think he gave up on them.

Went to visit 4thgennovas.com last week and it was not working. Too bad cuz he was on the right path with tech stuff, at least with the clutch pedal installation. Would like to know where he went and if he still had the tech stuff saved somewhere.

Glad to see you're back.

Jay

[Green Dragon]

That's too bad about Tony then, hope he didn't get burnt out and give up on em / move on .

Especially since he was working on both reroducing some items, and working on getting other made, etc. good ambassador for the 4th gen guys.

getting way off topic here.. but I'm surprised others, like NNN have not worked on getting / pushing mnore 4th gen items - or cars.
when I was a member 1990 ish to about 2000-2001 there were features on em, and Wayne seemed 'into' those, least built a few and showed people they are appreciated.
I did not renew when laid off, then it was a few years until I reupped - in the last year or so, have not seen one 4th gen feature article, and nothing in the way of parts ,etc.
I know they put some pressure on manufacturers for 3rd gen stuff, and it worked, so who knows...

~ AL